[shari91]

Wasnt sure how Vegas generally handled tennis to be honest, but realize its far from one of their biggest markets. I more brought to have more than only NHL alone to make the point that all their sports rules may not be the industry standard, and you're right it varies quite a lot, but as far as offshores go I cant think of a single other place that treats them the way BM does.

I know there are EU books that voids, aussies I'm not familiar with, I know its not uncommon among asians to void, but offshores generally does not.

To me the standard has always been complete 1st set (2 sets on majors on some books), but that maybe the majority dont share my opinion on that. Anyway, the only point I was trying to make if they're supposed to be able to fall back on "standard rules", then I think it makes perfect sense for a player to expect markets to be standard rules to start with without having to read some fine print. If there is no Vegas rules to play by, I think standard offshore rules should be next.

ps. I reckon pinny takes a good chunk on tennis, not sure how they stack up vs b365 but wouldnt be surprised if they take more. I also think betfair got a good case.

betfair and pinny have huge tennis markets but they're not exactly offshore, are they? Betfair's on a stock exchange so obviously we can't compare that to a book in CR and Pinny doesn't take US bettors as a general rule. That's my whole point. You can't use offshore books who only cater to Americans, who neither bet the sport much nor understand it, as the definitive standard for tennis betting. And that's why there is no 'Vegas Standard' for tennis. When it comes to tennis rules it truly is each book to its own. That's why when you even mention standard offshore rules I have to disagree because there aren't any. Offshore books are grabbing Euro/Aussie/Asian rules... books that were established well before the Internet and there isn't one standard. Also why more importantly as a bettor if you hit the Tennis Forum people will tell you to familiarise yourself with your books' rules before making a wager.

[benandjerry]

betfair and pinny have huge tennis markets but they're not exactly offshore, are they? Betfair's on a stock exchange so obviously we can't compare that to a book in CR and Pinny doesn't take US bettors as a general rule. That's my whole point. You can't use offshore books who only cater to Americans, who neither bet the sport much nor understand it, as the definitive standard for tennis betting. And that's why there is no 'Vegas Standard' for tennis. When it comes to tennis rules it truly is each book to its own. That's why when you even mention standard offshore rules I have to disagree because there aren't any. Offshore books are grabbing Euro/Aussie/Asian rules... books that were established well before the Internet and there isn't one standard. Also why more importantly as a bettor if you hit the Tennis Forum people will tell you to familiarise yourself with your books' rules before making a wager.

I consider pinny offshore (Curacao), despite not officially taking US customers. I didnt bring betfair into it because I believe they're offshore, but rather because I believe action after first set is more common than not out of a volume perspective. Did you see BM's most recent rule change related to the issue discussed in this thread? Taken straight out of pinny's rule book.

Tennis is definitely the worse example of the 2, and I agree there is no 'definite' standard, but it would make sense to use rules that all other places available to US customers does, wouldnt you agree? Please enlighten me on the notable offshore books besides BM you have in mind thats grabbed euro/aussie/asian tennis rules.

You should most definitely read the rules on beforehand, and I'm not saying its anything wrong with their tennis rules, they're crystal clear. My original point was only if you should be able to claim industry standard rules in case of a poorly worded rule, maybe your entire set of rules should be aimed to be industry standard, that may or may not make sense to you, but it does to me.

[sharpcircle]

arguments used by Bookmaker apologist:

spirit of the rule
Vegas standard
rule clarification

Request by player:
Follow your posted rules


EVIDENCE PROVIDED FROM SBR / BOOKMAKER FOR ANY CLAIMS:

0

9 days and counting... how did SBR side with BOOKMAKER unless there was evidence for BOOKMAKERS claims

[sharpcircle]

Also i've been warned I will be banned so I will not be insulting anyone or making jokes I will only use facts from now on. I will do nothing that could potentially get me banned.

[sharpcircle]

Customer Service
May 27, 2013 (a month ago)


1. Any game or event must be played to its conclusion on the same day in order to have action on full game props, irrespective of whether or not an official result is confirmed.
BETDSI Support Team

Phone Number: 1-877-223-8374

They changed the rule to this a few days later (this time no message to players) :

1. Any game or event must be played to its conclusion on the same day or within 5 hours of the next day in order to have action on full game props, irrespective of whether or not an official result is confirmed.

Then another change to the rules (again no message to players even though the new rule contradicts the message sent to all players on May 27th):

1. Any game or event must be played to its conclusion within 7 days in order to have action on full game props. Wagers on games that are suspended on the day of the game but played to conclusion within 7 days of the start time have action and will be graded based on the completed game score.

They significantly have changed there rules multiple times after the NEW LIVE RULES message that they sent to players less than 1 month ago.

How can we keep upto date with rules when we get messages about rule changes and then rules are changed multiple times within weeks without any messages or communication to the players.

This are unacceptable and shows Bookmakers blatant disregard for their customers.

[teaserpleaser]

5dimes also changes rules on the fly

[sharpcircle]

So its been over 3 weeks and SBR and Bet Cris haven't shown any information or evidence that would show their actions were justified.

Does this leave us to assume that books are innocent until proven guilty and have no burden of proof on them in disputes. This isn't how objective arbitration is supposed to work. I have filed a complaint and don't get an answer for a simple question; How does SBR side with Bookmaker in this dispute without providing evidence to the player/anyone.

SO again I will ask SBR/BOOKMAKER:

PLEASE produce evidence of your claims that justify you stealing my money.

[sharpcircle]

this one couldn't be clearer.

SBR Forum,

It doesn't seem like a easy case at all considering the amount of times Bet Cris has changed their story and rules.

Please provide the information that helped you come to the conclusion that "this one couldn't be clearer"