[samserif]

I recently opened an account with Topbet.com and was surprised by what it takes to withdraw funds. They want:

• a scanned copy of the card that I used for my initial deposit (front and back);
• a scanned copy of government issued photo ID (drivers license, passport, etc.); and
• a signed form that includes all info from my card: cardholder name, exp. date, security code, and card number.

This makes me feel very uncomfortable. Is this type of information request unusual?

[bigboydan]

First off, Welcome to the SBR forum sir

Topbet (SBR Rated F) is part of the Futurebet family of books and has had more than their fair of player complaints levied against them over the yeas and is currently on the SBR BlackList. My advice is if you want to play at a book that treats you fair as well as pays then I have listed a few books that cater to U.S. players below you might want to checkout.


5Dimes (SBR Rated A+)
Bookmaker (SBR Rated A+)
Bodog (SBR Rated A)
BetIslands (SBR Rated B-)
DSI (SBR Rated A+)
Legends (SBR Rated A+)
Heritage (SBR Rated B+)

The books I've mentioned are all in good standing and have player complaints against them at this time.


Now to answer your question about the faxing of your info. That's a pretty standard thing nowadays so I wouldn't be concerned about that at all really.

[goblue12]

Standard procedure for withdrawals, some request it for deposits.

[easywinner]

Standard procedure for withdrawals, some request it for deposits.

What's stopping them from making fraudulent charges or going on a spending spree with your card? Think about it, ever order something online or over the phone? That's exactly the info they ask you for and you are going to give it to someone in a foreign country? There would be no recourse either. How can you trust them or be so sure that their processors or files are secure? Even if they don't misuse your card on purpose, what's stopping a thief in their country or a hacker from accessing it? I used to bash the U.S. government for not openly allowing offshore gambling, now i see why they do it. They are just looking out for their citizens, trying to protect them and prevent fraud or id theft.

[Hareeba!]

What's stopping them from making fraudulent charges or going on a spending spree with your card? Think about it, ever order something online or over the phone? That's exactly the info they ask you for and you are going to give it to someone in a foreign country? There would be no recourse either. How can you trust them or be so sure that their processors or files are secure? Even if they don't misuse your card on purpose, what's stopping a thief in their country or a hacker from accessing it? I used to bash the U.S. government for not openly allowing offshore gambling, now i see why they do it. They are just looking out for their citizens, trying to protect them and prevent fraud or id theft.

Talk about paranoia and outright bullshit!
They aren't in some third world backblock ... UK bookies operate in a fully legal regulated environment and are required to demand these details.
If you're not prepared to provide them stick with the unregulated Costa Rica mob.
I know where I'd rather have my money.

[lukahh]

usual info in regulated environment...

costa rica is regulated by SBR - but only those who advertize on SBR.

[michael777]

i have sent well over 100 scanned documents to books in my life,no problems at all

[samserif]

Thanks Dan (& everyone else),

I signed up with Topbet based on a recommendation at Covers.com. It seems there's some controversy there.

I understand that any site that collects card details is a potential risk. What concerned me, though, was why they would want a scanned paper form with the same info that they had collected electronically as well as a scanned, high-resolution copy of my passport or other ID card.

I can see how the scanned card/ID by itself could be used to guard against card theft. I asked the customer service rep if I could remove the ID number from my passport and she agreed, so I feel better about that. To be safe, I've added a pale watermark "For ID purposes, requested by topbet.com" on top of the scan.

But asking for all my card info, plus my signature, on a separate scanned form looks to me like an unnecessary risk.

[jimkotecki]

Rofl, what stops any store from doing the same thing? Or your mortgage company? Or the IRS!

[bigboydan]

Thanks Dan (& everyone else),

I signed up with Topbet based on a recommendation at Covers.com. It seems there's some controversy there

I understand that any site that collects card details is a potential risk. What concerned me, though, was why they would want a scanned paper form with the same info that they had collected electronically as well as a scanned, high-resolution copy of my passport or other ID card.

I can see how the scanned card/ID by itself could be used to guard against card theft. I asked the customer service rep if I could remove the ID number from my passport and she agreed, so I feel better about that. To be safe, I've added a pale watermark "For ID purposes, requested by topbet.com" on top of the scan.

But asking for all my card info, plus my signature, on a separate scanned form looks to me like an unnecessary risk.

No problem Sir,

I'm just trying to offer my wisdom to you regarding this establishment. Now I understand Covers is a place of business and I personally can't fault them for accepting ad revenue from lower tier books however, in the case of TopBet (SBR Rated F). I feel it was just way to risky for them to do after what happen with that entire BetEd fiasco that happen roughly not 4 months ago.

[secretstash]

Thanks Dan (& everyone else), I signed up with Topbet based on a recommendation at Covers.com. It seems there's some controversy there. I understand that any site that collects card details is a potential risk. What concerned me, though, was why they would want a scanned paper form with the same info that they had collected electronically as well as a scanned, high-resolution copy of my passport or other ID card. I can see how the scanned card/ID by itself could be used to guard against card theft. I asked the customer service rep if I could remove the ID number from my passport and she agreed, so I feel better about that. To be safe, I've added a pale watermark "For ID purposes, requested by topbet.com" on top of the scan. But asking for all my card info, plus my signature, on a separate scanned form looks to me like an unnecessary risk.

all pretty standard stuff at even the top A+ books around. my suggestion is send the shit and get out FAST. that book is bankrupt/scam as much as they come

-stash

[samserif]

Rofl, what stops any store from doing the same thing? Or your mortgage company? Or the IRS!

Aside from enforceable laws? Businesses try to signal their stability to customers in ways such as making large capital expenditures. This is why banks have fancier offices than used car dealers: the bank is telling you that they'll be there tomorrow while the car dealer doesn't care what you think. I'd feel more secure dealing with a sports book operating from a building that it owned in the middle of Macau than one operating from a flat in the Manilla suburbs, even if the latter offered better deals due to lower costs.

---

Here's an open question for everyone: how do evaluate the stability of offshore sportsbooks? A long history of good service (meaning that the company has built a valuable reputation that it's not likely to throw away)? Country of operations? Costly marketing campaigns (e.g., Bodog's TV commercials)?

[Scooter]

There are 2 different issues here:

1) Can books demand such personal and normally confidential information?

Apparently they can and do and most customers accept this.

The more important question for me:

2) Should a company be able to demand this in order to allow one to make a withdrawal?


Even the US Pentagon and US Defense Dep't. computers have been hacked, as well as countless numbers of "secure" computers of various businesses.
Certainly the US Defense Dep't. computers are in a "secure" "regulated" environment.

There should be a limit on what the book can demand, and ALL ID REQUIREMENTS NEED TO BE STATED UP FRONT (before deposit).

(I realize that some of these books do make this clear up front in their T&C).

[easywinner]

Talk about paranoia and outright bullshit!
They aren't in some third world backblock ... UK bookies operate in a fully legal regulated environment and are required to demand these details.
If you're not prepared to provide them stick with the unregulated Costa Rica mob.
I know where I'd rather have my money.

Me too. In Vegas, where it's guaranteed, safe and legal. Tell your bs to all the Americans that are getting ****** right now via the scam that Full Tilt was running from a British crown territory. It's pretty obvious many people on here work for books located in foreign countries with some of these responses.

[easywinner]

Rofl, what stops any store from doing the same thing? Or your mortgage company? Or the IRS!

The fact that they face serious criminal action if they get caught doing it. Not to mention all the negative press, lawsuits, scrutiny they would be under. They have something called business laws and ethics in America. Foreign countries don't abide by American laws, so there are no repercussions. Plus the law enforcement jurisdiction to investigate and enforce would be limited outside of the country. Typical businesses don't keep photocopied records of your private information on hand either. I can't remember the last time the clerk at "any big box store America" wrote down the *** numbers on the back of my card or wanted to photocopy my drivers license license numbers. Unfortunately it's inevitable and some people in the right positions do take advantage of customers. I've read cases of waiters at restaurants stealing the identity of a customer before. Bad things are going to happen to people, that's why you need to be aware and vigilant. 9 million Americans have their identity stolen each year. If you have it happen to you, you won't think it's funny anymore.

[the_orangekat]

What's stopping them from making fraudulent charges or going on a spending spree with your card? Think about it, ever order something online or over the phone? That's exactly the info they ask you for and you are going to give it to someone in a foreign country? There would be no recourse either. How can you trust them or be so sure that their processors or files are secure? Even if they don't misuse your card on purpose, what's stopping a thief in their country or a hacker from accessing it? I used to bash the U.S. government for not openly allowing offshore gambling, now i see why they do it. They are just looking out for their citizens, trying to protect them and prevent fraud or id theft.

Whoah...if you REALLY think the US govt is trying to protect their citizens by banning online gambling and it has nothing to do with not being able to tax winnings, you are insane!

[easywinner]

Whoah...if you REALLY think the US govt is trying to protect their citizens by banning online gambling and it has nothing to do with not being able to tax winnings, you are insane!

What were you saying again? So you're telling me i should believe you over 2 big name sources and the government right? If you want to argue at least get your facts straight and load your gun before firing! Where do you clowns come from??

http://espn.go.com/poker/story/_/id/...mended-black-f

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/0...?ncid=webmail4

[(Reyes)]

A bit unusual to me, but if the amount is huge, it's common.

[scott235]

Me too. In Vegas, where it's guaranteed, safe and legal. Tell your bs to all the Americans that are getting ****** right now via the scam that Full Tilt was running from a British crown territory. It's pretty obvious many people on here work for books located in foreign countries with some of these responses.

You are dead on in your assessment. If you are not an arber, and don't deposit with a cc or wire, this should be a non issue. If you bet under a nickel and handicap, stick withP2P, negotiate a resonable % on payouts (not to exceed 5%), you should never have to show dox.

Sportsbooks say it's to prevent multi-accounting...this is bullshit-this info is worth a lot of dough and they are selling it. Remember heritage?

I have only sent a DL once, and I never will again. Remember, this is a very competitive business, you are not applying for a job, a loan, or opening a bank account. You post cash up front, remember? Many many top books will work with you, don't be fooled and listen to all this nonsense. This is also another reason to get a customer service rep assigned to your account. Any book that won't give you one, walk away from.

[durito]

What's stopping them from making fraudulent charges or going on a spending spree with your card? Think about it, ever order something online or over the phone? That's exactly the info they ask you for and you are going to give it to someone in a foreign country? There would be no recourse either. How can you trust them or be so sure that their processors or files are secure? Even if they don't misuse your card on purpose, what's stopping a thief in their country or a hacker from accessing it? I used to bash the U.S. government for not openly allowing offshore gambling, now i see why they do it. They are just looking out for their citizens, trying to protect them and prevent fraud or id theft.

i didnīt know people could be this stupid. well except for hareeba

[Hareeba!]

i didnīt know people could be this stupid. well except for hareeba

well as I agree with you that that is one of the dumbest posts ever made we must be equally stupid?

[scott235]

Also, to an id thief who is good at what he does, a DL is more valuable than a cc. Add to the DL the cc, a bank account number, and a utility bill with a phone #, VERY DAnGEROUS.

[scott235]

....another useful tidbit of info. Are you aware that in the EU and many other countries, you "own the rights" to your sensitive personal and financial data? And if this is info is sold or transferred without your express permission, there are serious consequences for companies that violate your privacy rights and misuse your data. In the U.S., you DO NOT own the rights to your financial and personal data. So, this is what happens. Companies collect and data mine, and of course thy always promise to keep your info secure, and then they turn right around and sell it because there is no recourse for the consumer.