[portman]

Yeah it's not insignificant in relation to my bankroll either. I have 4 other good mates who are owed 20k+ each so between the 5 of us we're owed about 120k alone. I know of a punter owed 100k but that's about 2% of his bankroll so i wont lose too much sleep for him. Thanks for the updates Boar.

Mate of mine will hopefully be having a face to face with Steve Chant (CEO) on Fri so hopefully he can glean some info for us. And then give him an uppercut from all of us of course!

Keep us posted for any updates mate. Although I am not that optimistic, I am not willing to simply give it up without chase them as much as I can

[sportscash]

I think i have about 60 cents left in there so fortunate for me. I hope it all works out for everyone.

[tommygun]

Yeah, no disrespect to Tom but before he officially launched I'd received some sort of "come take a look and give us feedback" email and I had hoped that he was going to offer a few more exciting options than the standard vanilla Aussie book crap. But nothing happened. And now each week I still get some sort of newsletter from them (despite requesting several times to be taken off the mailing list) so out of curiosity I'll check their site each time. Unless you're punting on horses, you're better off just going to a pub and placing sports bets. At least you might score a deal on a parma and pot while betting crappy TAB lines.

yeah other than the crappy lines I did notice that Tom Waterhouse posts weekly videos, "The Smarts" where he gives you his predictions, wrap up and insight on horse racing. He also has another interesting segment where he gives the days biggest bets (always winners), and in one video he mentioned one punter put $200,000 on a horse that got up, and a few bets of $100,000.

[rogue trader]

i dont mind those posts he makes and the tips from The Baron arent bad reading. He does take racing bets of those size. no doubt laying them off most of the time though...

[boar]

I think we may have to be patient and wait for the liquidator's report.

I rang the Mercury in Tassie yesterday and offered my help if they required
any inside info on the story. Aussie media quite ofter needs a good kick up
the backside to report on real stories. If the liquidator's report is negative
I think people with outstanding balances should call journos at various papers
and keep the pressure on the ACT govt.

The key issue is the segregated account. The initial stories missed this.

As I mentioned previously I am not sure a Class Action woud reap any rewards
but a concerted media campaign could. If the liquidator is the bearer of bad news
surely the likes of A Current Affair could consider it a worthwhile story.

Watch this space.

[Hareeba!]

........

[Hareeba!]

.....

[Kindred]

Both of these sites have been down for a couple of days. I then went to BetFair Aus Multis which uses Sportsalive and I read below what the story is. It is a shame Sportslaive could not have sent an email. This concerns me about customer funds and pending bets. Lets hope the closure is handled correctly.

Site Announcement

Betfair wishes to advise you that Sports Alive, the provider of Betfair's Aus Multis Product, has ceased operating its bookmaking operations and subsequently we are unable to offer Aus Multis until further notice. All Betfair customer funds are protected and remain available.

In respect of outstanding bets placed via Aus Multis, whilst those bets are between Sports Alive and our customers, as a goodwill gesture Betfair will guarantee the payout of winning bets to our customers. Please note it may take us additional time to settle winning bets due to Sports Alive's automated systems having been shut down.

We understand that this will impact the betting habits of customers and wish to apologise for the inconvenience. Betfair is committed to offering Aus Multis to our customers and we will endeavour to have the product available as soon as possible

goodwill my ass, your a bunch of crooks and your business would suffer if you didn't honor those bets

[chance]

I agree that is a shocking statement by Betfair. They should have said we will be honouring all bets placed on our site on the Ausmulti option. The bets were listed on their site so they can just settled them. To suggest they are doing any one a goodwill gesture is stupid.

[chance]

It would be nice to be able to log into my Sportsalive account to see if I have any pending bets.

[portman]

http://www.canberratimes.com.au/news...e/2275778.aspx

Informative article

[portman]

http://www.canberratimes.com.au/news...e/2275778.aspx

Informative article

[Hareeba!]

http://www.canberratimes.com.au/news...e/2275778.aspx

Informative article

Once again a report totally failing to mention the apparent failure to comply with the requirement that punters' funds be maintained in a segregated account and overseen by the government regulator!


Bet247, which operates through Sports Alive but is a separate company, has been taken over by Tom Waterhouse.

[Hareeba!]

Sports Alive customers may wish to make their views known to Katy Gallagher, the ACT's Chief Commissioner:

gallagher@act.gov.au

[chance]

Important Notice
Dear ,
We are excited to announce that Bet247 has come to an arrangement with Tom Waterhouse NT Pty Ltd (tomwaterhouse.com). The Waterhouse name is an icon in Australian bookmaking and we are confident that tomwaterhouse.com will continue to provide the premium service you have come to expect.

The previous licensed bookmaker providing wagering services to Bet247 clients was Sports Alive Pty Ltd (in liquidation) (Sports Alive). Bet247 Pty Ltd (Bet247) is transferring all client data from Sports Alive to tomwaterhouse.com, effective immediately.

This is a notice to you under clause 3(b) of the agreement between you and Sports Alive that Sports Alive is no longer authorized to use the domain name and trade marks of Bet247, and that tomwaterhouse.com is the new bookmaker we have selected. The new bookmaker is an online wagering services provider licensed under the laws of the Northern Territory and will use the Bet247 domain name and trade marks.

The terms and conditions on which tomwaterhouse.com provides wagering services are available at this link: http://www.tomwaterhouse.com/terms.asp

What you need to do
To confirm that you agree to tomwaterhouse.com becoming your new wagering provider and accept the terms and conditions of tomwaterhouse.com, you need to log in to tomwaterhouse.com with your existing Bet247 username and password before 15 September 2011.
If you do this:

1. We will ensure that (subject to tomwaterhouse.com verification requirements being met) an amount equal to your account balance as per Bet247's records at 9am AEST on Thursday, 25 August 2011 (which will not include any unpaid withdrawal requests made prior to that time) is immediately available for wagering or withdrawal from tomwaterhouse.com.
2. You agree that:
   
   • you assign (transfer) to us absolutely any claim you may have to recover your account balance as at the liquidation from Sports Alive, its liquidator, or any third party.
   
   
   
   • you authorise us to give notice, on your behalf, of this assignment to Sports Alive; and you will sign any document we reasonably request of you to confirm the above.

If you choose not to accept our offer on the terms set out above, you will not be able to place wagers with, or withdraw any funds from, tomwaterhouse.com. Instead, you would need to make a claim against the liquidator of Sports Alive.

If you have any queries, please contact tomwaterhouse.com on web@tomwaterhouse.com
Kind Regards,


Bet247 Customer Service

[Hareeba!]

I'm puzzled by this.

As I read it it seems that if you have money at 247 as well as Sports Alive you will have to relinquish any claim for the Sports Alive balance if you accept your 247 balance being transferred to Waterhouse??????

I'm probably wrong on that but if I had more than 4 cents at Alive I'd be making sure what that really means before proceeding with the Waterhouse thing.

[Santo]

The SA stuff is confusing, but I'd be very cautious if you had more in pending withdrawals than active balance at 247. You might need to do some math, but I'm not sure how long you have to accept/refuse the TW offer.

[Hareeba!]

I've now been advised by Waterhouse that the offer is NOT available to punters who have an active or former account with them!

[rogue trader]

I've now been advised by Waterhouse that the offer is NOT available to punters who have an active or former account with them!

Yeh i was told that too. Thankfully they are honouring my futures plays though which is all i really had there.

[Hareeba!]

Yeh i was told that too. Thankfully they are honouring my futures plays though which is all i really had there.

yep that is great news

and they have informed me that our funds are safe and those who Waterhouse doesn't want will be contacted to arrange a withdrawal (note to Potless, Tommy and Brettels - this is information I'm passing on in good faith believing it to be correct at this point in time but it doesn't come with a personal guarantee!)

I will be very surprised if Tom Waterhouse hangs on to many of the customers he's just acquired unless he significantly boosts his sports betting options and odds in a big hurry. Currently there is just no comparison with what Sports Alive/Bet 247 offered us.

[in play, run(s)]

So in a nutshell, what does this mean for sportsalive customers?

[Hareeba!]

So in a nutshell, what does this mean for sportsalive customers?

SFA

The best hope is to put maximum pressure on the ACT government and embarrass them sufficiently to cough up the shortfall to punters.

[rogue trader]

So in a nutshell, what does this mean for sportsalive customers?

It means zilch. It only relates to b247 clients.

With SA, i've heard there is still someone interested in buying it. Don’t know who though, dont know how factual that is either. Certainly not holding my breath.


There should be an article in tomorrow Canberra Times that should be a lot more hard-hitting, damning Jones and talking class action. Might be interesting...

[portman]

It means zilch. It only relates to b247 clients.

With SA, i've heard there is still someone interested in buying it. Don’t know who though, dont know how factual that is either. Certainly not holding my breath.


There should be an article in tomorrow Canberra Times that should be a lot more hard-hitting, damning Jones and talking class action. Might be interesting...

I have the same information without any specific details on names etc...Initially I thought that our case is a lost one, but as Hareeba was saying yesterday, apparently I have come to believe that something can be done.

[AimingHigh]

So, to summarise for Bet24/7 players:
(1) if you had a TomWaterhouse account already, only your pending future bets will be honoured, and NOT your current balance or any pending withdrawals;
(2) if you did NOT have a TomWaterhouse account already, your current balance and pending future bets will be honoured, BUT NOT any unpaid withdrawals from 25 Aug or before.

Not as generous as it first looks, then, but still pretty good for most people I hope. Ironically, I'm now grateful for what I had perceived as my stupidity, as I had thought about withdrawing on the 24th, but decided to leave my funds there for the upcoming cricket.

[rogue trader]

One older article I hadn't seen before that has slightly more information than previous ones.
http://www.smartcompany.com.au/leisu...ig-losses.html

Did anyone read the Ray Thomas 'article' if you could call it that (more like an advertorial) today in the Telegraph. http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/spo...-1226125957158 What a puff piece of cheque-book style journalism. Tom 'The White Knight' and 'punters pal'- spare me. He didnt bail punters out for 1mill, closer to 100k actually and B247 hadnt gone under, all he did was purchase a client list.

[Hareeba!]

So, to summarise for Bet24/7 players:
(1) if you had a TomWaterhouse account already, only your pending future bets will be honoured, and NOT your current balance or any pending withdrawals;
(2) if you did NOT have a TomWaterhouse account already, your current balance and pending future bets will be honoured, BUT NOT any unpaid withdrawals from 25 Aug or before.

Not as generous as it first looks, then, but still pretty good for most people I hope. Ironically, I'm now grateful for what I had perceived as my stupidity, as I had thought about withdrawing on the 24th, but decided to leave my funds there for the upcoming cricket.

No.
As I understand it you will be paid in full by either Bet247 or Waterhouse, including pending withdrawals and futures.
I suggest you give 247 a call to clarify your situation.

[Hareeba!]

Commission denies poor form in investigating Sports Alive claims


BY HENRIETTA COOK
01 Sep, 2011 12:00 AM
Punters have accused the ACT Gambling and Racing Commission of being ''grossly negligent'' in its handling of embattled betting shop Sports Alive and are likely to file a class action lawsuit against the government regulator.But the commission insists it has done its job properly and raised the possibility of fraud being involved in the company's collapse.
Thousands of Australians look set to lose $1.5 million after the collapse of ACT-registered Sports Alive, which was placed into liquidation last Thursday despite returning profits of about $5 million last year.
Punters told The Canberra Times they contacted the commission up to two months ago to raise concerns about the company.
Sydney resident Matt Fisk, who expects to lose $22,000 from the collapse of Sports Alive, phoned the ACT commission a month ago after he was unable to withdraw $17,000 from his account.
''They told me to relax, that the money was in a safe account and everything would be fine,'' he said.
''The ACT Government have failed their duty of care. It seems the gambling and racing commission were happy to collect their cash but do no work.''
Mr Fisk said he was seeking legal advice about whether to pursue a class action lawsuit against the ACT Government.
He said up to 100 hard-done-by punters had shown interest in joining the class action.
But ACT Gambling and Racing Commission chairman Malcolm Gray said while complaints about late payments had been made, these had been investigated and resolved.
''There were various matters but none of these issues were of a magnitude that indicated insolvency,'' he said. ''It's possible the company has been subjected to fraud. If this is so, other regulators including the police and Australian Securities and Investment Commission may be interested.''
A Canberra punter who stands to lose $50,000 said he contacted the commission two months ago when he became aware Sports Alive was writing ''paid'' on unpaid accounts.
He had been barred from withdrawing money from his account, but was allowed to place bets.
''I voiced concerns three times, they have been grossly negligent for not informing the public. Sports Alive had been trading while insolvent.''
Under ACT Laws, sports bookmakers must provide the commission with detailed information about all betting transactions at the end of each month. Bookmakers must also keep a separate account for all betting monies received.
Legislation states that sports bookmakers must not withdraw money from this trust account until ''the outcome of the bet is determined''.
The company's collapse has coincided with the beginning of the US Open, and the looming AFL and NRL finals. Thousands of punters had placed bets on the outcomes of these events.
A former Sports Alive employee said the company was trading up until the point of liquidation.
''If the monthly reports Sports Alive was supposed to provide to the ACT Gambling and Racing Commission were legitimate than I don't understand how this has happened.''
The employee said staff became aware of the company's dire financial state after they were unable to pay out clients.
A prominent Melbourne bookmaker said the collapse of Sports Alive had spooked customers.
''People are panicking and withdrawing their money. It seems the ACT Gaming and Racing Commission have washed their hands and said it is not our problem. It is not their fault the company collapsed but they should have been addressing people's concerns and prevented them from trading.''
Tasmanian state-owned betting agency TOTE owns a 25 per cent stake in Sports Alive and is expected to lose about $4 million. Private investors affected by the company's collapse include Mick Malthouse's manager Peter Sidwell and Victorian bookmaker Gary Walsh.

[chance]

Maybe bet365 who are preparing to set up shop in Auatralia could buy the customer list. Reading above it sounds like a huge mess. Does anyone know how to contact Matt fisk so that I can join the class action.

[rogue trader]

No.
As I understand it you will be paid in full by either Bet247 or Waterhouse, including pending withdrawals and futures.
I suggest you give 247 a call to clarify your situation.

"We will ensure that (subject to tomwaterhouse.com verification requirements being met) an amount equal to your account balance as per Bet247's records at 9am AEST on Thursday, 25 August 2011 (which will not include any unpaid withdrawal requests made prior to that time) is immediately available for wagering or withdrawal from tomwaterhouse.com."

[boar]

Matt Fisk is on twitter - fisky76.

Obviously we are going to have to wait for the
liquidator's report before any class action can
be contemplated.

I am glad the second Canberra Times article was
a lot punchier than the first. I am not sure it had
anything to do with the message left on the reporter's
voicemail emphasizing the need to examine the issue
of the segregated account!

[Hareeba!]

"We will ensure that (subject to tomwaterhouse.com verification requirements being met) an amount equal to your account balance as per Bet247's records at 9am AEST on Thursday, 25 August 2011 (which will not include any unpaid withdrawal requests made prior to that time) is immediately available for wagering or withdrawal from tomwaterhouse.com."

Yes, but I understood that is because Bet247 had already deducted the amount from the player balance and intends to complete the withdrawal along with those for whom Waterhouse isn't taking over. But best to call 247 and clarify it.

[boar]

Worth reading the comments on that Matt Fisk article. Appears
to be some movement wrt a class action.

http://makingthenut.com/content/punt...ct#comment-362

[Hareeba!]

Matt Fisk is on twitter - fisky76.

Obviously we are going to have to wait for the
liquidator's report before any class action can
be contemplated.

I am glad the second Canberra Times article was
a lot punchier than the first. I am not sure it had
anything to do with the message left on the reporter's
voicemail emphasizing the need to examine the issue
of the segregated account!

If the segregated account doesn't contain the money it should I would have thought the ACT regulator should have already called in the police to investigate the matter?

[boar]

Fair point but I am afraid I dont have much confidence in the ACT regulators.
In my day the regulators were extremely strict and competent.
If the segregated account was properly ringfenced then I am surprised
Greg Jones didnt mention this in the press. He has implied the bond is
the only source of funds that could be paid back to the clients.
His behaviour has been extraordinary and in most countries he would be
forced to resign - not down under!