1. #1
    samus82
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    Chelsea not to finish in top 4 2011/12

    Ok I know this seems crazy, but I have spent a lot of time thinking about this.

    I am betting Liverpool to finish in the top 4 next season (explaination near the end). In order to do so one of the current top 4 obviously can't. I have written a summary of my predictions for each club next year.

    First off Man Utd. Considering how they have played this season and the squad they have, it is difficult to see how they won't be challenging for the title again next season. When I look at the squad sometimes it baffles me how they do so well. Veteran players such as Giggs have obviously been a big help, but they have made good additions aswell. Nani and Chicarito for me are the best of them. Some of their greatest players eg Scholes and Giggs are coming to the end of their careers and it will hurt Utd. Scholes may retire at the end of this season, but Giggs will be there for another year at least. Regardless of this era of change, Man Utd are too strong and too well managed to drop out of the top 4 next season.

    Arsenal have really let themselves down the last 2 seasons. They have come so close to glory yet they have choked every time. The Carling Cup final this year was such a joke for them. Fair play to Birmingham but there is no way Arsenal should have lost that final. The club was desperate for silverware and they had all the ability to win that game. That has hurt their confidence so much. There is a lot of doom and gloom around Emirates and I'm sure Wenger will be hurting more than anyone. The 2 champions league games against Barca aswell. For some reason Arsenal kept telling themselves they were the underdogs, they couldn't do it blah blah blah, but they had a chance and if they had believed that they could have made it through (this year being the best chance). It seems probable that Fabregas will be departing this summer but I actually think it will benefit Arsenal in the long run. For too long Arsenal have been lost without Van Persie and Fabregas in the team. It is similar to Liverpool when they relied on Gerrard and Torres. But the Arsenal squad is so much better than the Liverpool squad. They need to take away that reliance on big names and learn that they are good players.

    Arsenal badly need a new keeper and a strong CB and I believe Wenger will break out the chequebook next season and sign the players he needs. I also think once Fabregas leaves, Wenger will build the team around Wilshere who is going to be one of the best players in the league. Depending on who they sign Arsenal might have a shot at the title, but once again I think it will be their mental fortitude that is put to the test rather than their football. Either way I think they will have more than enough to finish in the top 4.

    Man City have done what they needed to do this season. They got into the top 4 and won a trophy. Now Man City have an excellent array of players, although they don't play that well together as a team. But they have a ridiculous treasure chest and with CL they can attract the world's greatest players.

    It is a tricky situation for the owners. The only real weak link I see is Mancini. I don't think he is a bad manager I just don't think he can handle the pressure of the owner's demands. You can see in his interviews how much pressure that man is under. He has done everything asked of him this year though so I would be surprised if the owners axed him now. But I do think eventually they will attempt to bring in a manager capable of managing a team of Galacticos (yes, City are basically the new Real Madrid in terms of their financial power).

    Mancini's tactics are very dull and negative, but it pays off. Mourinho won the prem with Chelsea by playing some dull football and winning a lot of games 1-0. I think that with the money they have and the potential to sign players with CL qualification, City can only get stronger. I'm expecting City to become one of the toughest defensive teams in the league combined with some ridiculous flare players. They will once again qualify for the CL in 11/12.

    Finally Chelsea. Of all the clubs I see right now in the top 4, I can only see Chelsea getting weaker. First of all the management situation is a joke. Since Mourinho left in 2007 Chelsea have had 4 different managers (Grant, Scolari, Hiddink and Ancelotti). The majority of people are saying that Ancelotti is on his way out too. Whilst I think parting ways with Grant and Scolari were the right decisions, how the hell did they get the job in the first place? If Ancelotti does go Chelsea need to make a good decision on who they bring in to replace him.

    If a new manager does come in, from the off they know that if they don't achieve, they are going to get axed and quickly too. Now this is a common pressure in modern football today, but in my opinion Managers can't truly reach their potential unless they feel safe. Look what happened to Roy Hodgson. The man was so afraid to make a bad decision at Liverpool, that he ended up being the maker of his own demise. He was always the wrong choice for Liverpool, but he is a great example of how a manager can buckle under the pressure. Chelsea's new manager, or Ancelotti if he stays, will have to handle that pressure.

    Chelsea also have a very aged squad. Whilst they are all still great players, age takes its toll on everyone. The team is approaching a time of reshaping where key players are on the decline and need replacing (eg Drogba). One of the reasons I like this bet is I am not convinced Chelsea are capable of being as successful in the transfer window as their rivals. They signed David Luiz who has looked quality since he arrived, but Torres for £50m? I don't understand the logic behind that. It shows Chelsea have the financial muscle to compete in the transfer market, but do they have the sense? Having a philosophy of big price = good player can bury you. I think all the clubs I'm backing to finish in the top 4 next season have a better transfer policy than Chelsea and will end up having more success.

    A lot may argue that Arsenal are the weak link in the top 4 at the moment, but I think Wenger has enough experience to rebuild and succeed. Arsenal have been without a trophy for 6 years yet every year they are competing. I don't think the challenge at Wenger's feet is as daunting as Chelsea's. Wenger has so many young players that are only going to be better next season and they have been playing together as a team for a while. If Arsenal bring in a couple of key experienced players who can rally the troops in difficult games and keep them together mentally then they will be fine. Arsenal have been stitched up so many times by bad goal keeping and defending this season. If they can make the signings to correct that they will be a force again.

    Chelsea have been a good team this year, but great teams can easily fall, especially when good players are on their way out or in decline.

    Chelsea have had rampant starts to their last 2 campaigns, leaving everyone else playing catch up. I think with new players and a new manager Chelsea may struggle to get a good start which has been key for them in recent seasons.

    I am very confident Liverpool can regain Champions league next season. With the new owners the old regime of Hicks and Gillett is finally over! The debt and philosophy that has destroyed the club has gone. The new owners NESV have already started to work many strategies in order to succeed. They have made plans to renovate Anfield so that Liverpool can keep its great history alive in a great stadium. They have acquired a new sponsorship deal that gives them more money than any other club in the prem. They have tapped into the asian market aswell. End of the day football clubs are businesses that need to be run well. Obviously we as fans don't care about that side of it, but it is important to know our clubs are being run well and I feel NESV are laying great foundations for Liverpool to build on. Especially with the new UEFA financial rules coming into play, that mean no club can spend more than it earns on transfers etc. It is important for Liverpool to be as profitable as it can be so that it can reinvest that money in the team.

    Whilst the Liverpool squad in its current form might not quite have enough to make it into the top 4, with a few key additions I see no reason why they can't. Liverpool's problems are not that hard to fix either. Tottenham for instance have a good squad but they lack that quality striker to get them 20-30 goals a season. Great strikers aren't easy to acquire. Liverpool have players like Gerrard and Suarez to build the team around. Reina aswell, one of the best goalkeepers in the world and probably the best in the prem. If Liverpool can sure up a few positions eg. LB, CB and grab a quality winger, they will be a great force again.

    I am a Liverpool fan so obviously my opinion is biased but this bet is based on logic. I will also be taking a large bet on Liverpool to finish in the top 4. However in order to do so, someone has to fall and for me there is so much value in that team being Chelsea. They are 2nd favourite to win the title next season, so you can appreciate how good the odds will be for them not to get into the top 4. I will shop around for a price for a while and keep you posted.

  2. #2
    samus82
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    Sorry that was an essay but if you did manage to read it I found odds at b365 at 11/2. Still think I can find better though.

  3. #3
    alon7777777
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    Liverpool should be in top 4 next year even without addin players they have a good squad now exept for Kyrgiakos who is terrible Suarez is great Carrol is the best english striker to me (sorry Rooney fans) Gerrard still got a good year or two left in him and King Kenny signed for three more years i cant see em end up with less then a 4th place and u right about Chelsea but i think its between them and Arsenal

  4. #4
    hitman09
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    you have a good point, and I think the same way too even though I am Chelsea fan. Dumb owner and manager.

  5. #5
    The Special One
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    Arsenal vs Chelsea for 4th...

  6. #6
    samus82
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Special One View Post
    Arsenal vs Chelsea for 4th...
    Pretty much. Fancy Arsenal to get it though.

  7. #7
    TheBeautifulGame
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    Liverpool should get back into the top 4 next season. Challenging for the title? As a Liverpool fan, I'd love to say yeah but it probably won't be next season but you never know. Chelsea not being in the top 4 next season? Interesting.

    Now will Liverpool finish 5th this season for a Europa league spot? I hope so but Spurs must lose or draw and we must win. It can happen especially with Birmingham fighting for their lives.

  8. #8
    markteal
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    I think you make a good point about the way their squad is aging but I still can't see it happening unless they hire a total clown to be manager.

    United could well be weaker next season too, if they go cheap on a new keeper and fail to strengthen the centre of midfield yet again it could be a long season, but with Ferguson still in charge you can't see them falling out of the top four.

    City always manage to **** things up for themselves but when you throw that much cash around you're eventually gonna win the league, no way they finish outside the top four.

    Spurs always look good for a while then bottle it so I guess it will be between the scousers and arsenal for fourth spot, and while Suarez looks like a class signing, Carroll hasn't looked good so far and I can't see the yanks there spending too much cash, they're businessmen not mad Arab/Russian billionaires, so Arsenal for me, even though they are a bunch of slapped arse bottle merchants when things don't go there way

  9. #9
    samus82
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    I took Liverpool to finish above Tottenham ages ago when the odds were really good but got stitched up by the game at Anfield. It is possible considering Birmingham need a result to be sure of avoiding relegation but they have been awful recently. I'm not counting on anything but you never know.

    The title race next year is going to be really interesting. Man Utd only have 77 points this year, most they can finish on is 80. That's a joke. I honestly think anyone can challenge for it next season. Man City will definitely fancy a go at it. The thing with the title race is it can put so much pressure onto games and a lot of teams lose out because they can't take the pressure. Its one of the reasons why I think Man Utd have enjoyed so much success - they don't choke. Sure they play badly in some big games, but its not a case of choking. They just take 1 game at a time, they don't deliver themselves "must-win" ultimatums. Plenty of times I've seen managers like Wenger and Redknapp looking very forlorn saying "oh we must win this game" etc etc, when do you ever see Ferguson like that? Never, that man has no self doubt.

    The british media scrutinise anyone who flops a game. Remember JT's penalty miss against Utd in the CL final? He says he still has nightmares about it. So many players are afraid of this happening to them and they don't have a manager giving them the belief they need to succeed.

    As for Liverpool's chances of a title push. Dalglish has a lot of experience chasing after titles so he knows the drill. He will just tell the lads to keep their heads down and take it one game at a time. I'm really happy Liverpool have signed Dalglish and can't wait to see what he can do for the club next season.

  10. #10
    alon7777777
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    as a Liverpool fan i dont want them to finish 5th we dont need EL what we need is a good year in EPL and at least qualify for the CL i see Spurs goin 5th they will win vs Birmingham

  11. #11
    samus82
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    Quote Originally Posted by alon7777777 View Post
    as a Liverpool fan i dont want them to finish 5th we dont need EL what we need is a good year in EPL and at least qualify for the CL i see Spurs goin 5th they will win vs Birmingham
    I can see how not being in EL will give us more time and energy to focus on the prem, but I think it would be better for the club if we were in it. With the amount of youth players we are trying to involve the more games we have next season, the more game time they can get. The youth that is in the team at the moment will end up on the bench when the injured senior players return eg Spearing benched in place of Gerrard. We could play these players in Europa to allow them to keep growing as players.

  12. #12
    alon7777777
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    we got only 3-4 good youth prospects with Kelly and Spearing leadin on talent not sure bout Flanagan yet if Kyrgiakos will be gone and Aurelio injured as always they will play enough in the league to develop EL is garbage

  13. #13
    nobull
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    they truly suck balls ............. sob's cost me money ........... i'm done bettin them fools

  14. #14
    steviec27
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    I dont know about this but I guess its possible.

    The way I see it is Man Utd are nailed on top 4 (prob top 2), as much as I dont like them they just seem to get the job done year on year.

    Take Man U out of it and I think Chelsea, Arsenal, Liverpool, Spurs and Man City are very close to one another and it should make for a great CL race next year.

    Chelsea have a great team but an old one. The surge at the end of the season to come from nowhere to title contenders shows they still have it. If they can get both Torres and Drogba playing well together then it will be just scary and they should comfortably make it.

    Arsenal have a good young squad on paper but seem to choke it at every opportunity. Maybe thats something to do with the little experience in the squad (barring Fabregas who may yet leave) and Wenger may have to address this. Problem being he seems reluctant to spend and would rather buy/bring through young players (which to his credit he does very well), but to challenge for the title they will need to spend.

    With Gerrard back and Suarez and Carroll settling in I see a bright season for Liverpool and have a great chance of top 4 but prob not title just yet. There defence is a bit of a worry though.

    Spurs have a good balanced squad and are fairly strong in all positions, possibly a world class keeper needed but who dosent I guess. This seasons goal production as a whole has been poor from the likes of Crouch, Pav and Defoe, and if they want to challenge they all need to step up or another striker brought in to help VDV. The midfiled is solid and has pace down both flanks with Bale and Lennon if only Lennon could learn to cross. Not making the EL for next season would actually be a big boost for there challenge next season.

    If City lose Tevez though that is a massive loss and will need to replace him with a top notch striker to still be in it as without Tevez they would be nowhere near the top 4 this season, but lets face it they have the money and with CL can attract anyone by offering £200k p/w.

  15. #15
    samus82
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    Ancelotti is gone. The only reason I won't pull the trigger on this is if Chelsea get Hiddink or Villas-Boas. Otherwise I am confident on what I've already said.

  16. #16
    truebluebear
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    Well im gonna go in opposite direction , i believe Jose will be leaving Real this summer and he and Abramovich may kiss and make up , i think the EPL will be a fantastic 3 way struggle next season between CHELSEA , MAN CITY and MAN UTD and i think they may finish in that order ,anyway its a very interesting article and you make many good and valid points my friend , we will agree to disagree though on this one Samus , good luck and thnx for your time and insight .

  17. #17
    samus82
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    Quote Originally Posted by truebluebear View Post
    Well im gonna go in opposite direction , i believe Jose will be leaving Real this summer and he and Abramovich may kiss and make up , i think the EPL will be a fantastic 3 way struggle next season between CHELSEA , MAN CITY and MAN UTD and i think they may finish in that order ,anyway its a very interesting article and you make many good and valid points my friend , we will agree to disagree though on this one Samus , good luck and thnx for your time and insight .
    Yeah a Mourinho reunion with Chelsea might be deadly, but I just can't see it happening. Mourinho and Abramovich are both very proud people and someone would be portrayed as having their tail between their legs by the British media. I can't see either of them wanting to be that person. Besides it doesn't seem like Mourinho's style.

    But you are right, the odds are against me, but that's why I like the bet. I appreciate you calmly making your points rather than just calling me wrong and insulting me which seems to be what a lot of people do on these forums.

  18. #18
    barcelonafc
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    if chelsea buy a few new players then the title could be theres, no way they finish out top 4

  19. #19
    Daveyboy
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    Depends on the manager, but even still I am very doubtful. At least you got a good price, but you'll need them to have a Liverpool-like start to the season to trade out.

  20. #20
    samus82
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    Well Chelsea now need a small miracle to finish in the top 4, so whilst I won't celebrate until it has cashed, all likelihood is with a tired squad Chelsea are going to focus their best players on winning the CL to secure qualification next season. If Chelsea fail to win tonight then they can't finish in the top 4.

    I must admit there were a lot of factors I did not consider when I wrote this and I certainly had a naive opinion of Liverpool's prospects. Still part of life is learning from your mistakes and a lot did happen as predicted, certainly Chelsea' fragility was exposed many times this season and the side's confidence was crushed for a long period. Overall I am quite satisfied with this bet as it is very difficult to predict how events will unfold over a whole season. But I saw good value in the bet and if it cashes I will be very happy!

    Just wish I had hit it a bit harder!

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