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Burglar Green Rd3 OA4 EvenOriginally Posted by JohnGalt2341
*Holden Purple Rd3 OA15 +3
*Burglar Purple Rd3 OA15 +4
Holden Green Rd3 OA9 -4
I'm pretty sure Burglar's got me in the 2nd game. I'm not surprised, this guy is good. Looks like we'll both advance to the next round. Although... I see that Snazzy isn't done just yet.
Last edited by JohnGalt2341; 09-06-20 at 05:08 PM.
*Daniel Green Rd3 OA16 +4*Daniel Green Rd2 OA12 +2
Bernard Purple Rd2 OA8 Even
*Daniel Purple Rd2 OA16 +11**(Wow! Let's call this the single most OA gained in a single Round)
Bernard Green Rd2 OA5 Even.
Daniel Green Rd2 OA8 -2
*joook Purple Rd2 OA9 Even
*Daniel Purple Rd2 OA11 +2
jook Green Rd OA11 -1
*Round Winner
**Unofficial Hexversi Record
Bernard Purple Rd3 OA1 -7
Daniel Purple Rd3 OA14 Even
*Bernard Green Rd3 OA10 +5
Daniel Green Rd3 OA6 -2
*joook Purple Rd3 OA14 +5
*Daniel Purple Rd3 OA16 +5
joook Green Rd3 OA7 -4
time to man up and face the facts galt
What are you even talking about?
check PT
whole thread for you
Burglar Green Rd4 OA2 -2
**Holden Purple Rd4 OA12 -3 **Purple tapped Green out on move #26.
Burglar Purple Rd4 OA1 -14(Woah!)
*Holden Green Rd4 OA10 +1
I wasn't sure if I was going to win that 2nd game vs Burglar. This was a really interesting game because he really outplayed me for much of the first 3 Rounds. After about midway through the game, every single move I made had to be perfect or I think I would have lost. i was finally able to create a move in a section of 7 where I got the first and last moves in the section even though I had to give up a corner to get it. That's what won me the game because after that every single move he made he was creating at least 1 new move for me. By the end of the 4th round he had used all but 1 of his moves and I had actually gained 1 move. Great game though! This guy is good.
Speaking of which... I think Snazzy is going to win at least 1 game vs Burglar as well. I think I really underestimated Snazzy. He gave me a couple of good games as well. I really hope he joins the next tourney.
Let's take a look at the Judges scorecards for this 2nd game.
Burglar Purple
*Rd1 OA10 +7
Rd2 OA11 +1
*Rd3 OA15 +4
Rd4 OA1 -14
Holden Green
Rd1 OA7 Ev
*Rd2 OA13 +6
Rd3 OA9 -4
*Rd4 OA10 +1
Last edited by JohnGalt2341; 09-09-20 at 07:50 PM.
I was just looking at my current Hexversi Ladder game vs Toptal. We are on move #20. I counted up both of our Options Available and we each have 18. That's really high. Especially for both players. What makes this game so interesting to me is we are nearly halfway through and neither one of us has made a play on the sides yet but we both have several side moves available.
I haven't done any official study on it but I'd be willing to bet that players that are more patient with playing the sides fair better than those that are too eager. In my game with Toptal as of right now most of the side moves available to both of us are garbage moves that can be exploited, especially mine(Purple). I only have one good side move right now out of the bunch. The others I will have to wait until they become good, which will likely mean he moves on that side first.. He's got a few good options for his moves but he also has a bunch of terrible options as well.
This is a really good game and just my type of game really. Because although it is very complex he's still allowing me to play my style so I think I should be able to outplay him in the 2nd half of the game. I think I could probably teach you guys a lot of different things from this game. I'm going to try to set him up to make some bad plays on the sides in the moves to come. I guess 'we'll see if he falls for any traps...
blanko Green Rd2 OA7 -2After Round 1 of blanko's games with Ryan and Toptal.
blanko Green Rd1 OA9 +2
*Ryan Purple Rd1 OA13 +6
blanko Purple Rd1 OA9 +2
*Ryan Green Rd1 OA10 +3
*blanko Green Rd1 OA8 +1
Toptal Purple Rd1 OA4 -3
*blanko Purple Rd1 OA10 +3
Toptal Green Rd1 OA6 -1
*Ryan Purple Rd2 OA15 +2
blanko Purple Rd2 OA12 +3
*Ryan Green Rd2 OA14 +4
blanko Green Rd2 OA8 Even
*Toptal Purple Rd2 OA10 +6
blanko Purple Rd2 OA13 +3
*Toptal Green Rd2 OA13 +7
Man, it would've been sooo cool if we were the 3 to make it out of each of our groups into finals. I'm just not quite prepared for the strength of my group and also butchered a couple things. Pretty damn sure I'm doomed at this point. But gl in finals bros
It's official...
Section #1: completed Player's Name Score Games
com
pletedAvg score
per game
cmpltdDanielEspinosa (winner) 10 6 1.67 §joook 8 6 1.33 §Bernard says Stay Safe everyone. 6 6 1.00 §2PI76F 0 6 0.00
Nice work Daniel!! Welcome to the finals!
I was just looking in on Section 2 and I must say it looks like Toptal is playing really well in virtually all of his games. But I'm particularly interested in blanko's game vs Toptal where blanko is Green. It's on move #25 right now, Purple to move. These next few moves have potential to be extremely interesting. I think Toptal could make a mistake within the next few moves or so. If he gets away with it might be impossible to beat him but if you catch it you might be able to take control of the game. This looks like it's going to be fun!
Thanks! Only blanko left to make it a SBR final.
joook won both his game playing green and lost both his game playing purple. I thought it was variance, but maybe there is a small advantage after all?
Yeah, I'm probably going 0-6 or 1-5. This group is really good but I also think my brain broke or burnout or something. Every crucial choice I made was just the wrong one. I probably didn't spend as much time as I should have this round. Feelsbadman
This is not one of my classic early overreactions. These games are actually just almost all doomed for me, John can verify if he looks lol
But again gl in final round guys
Indeed. Well.. I would say you are almost certainly going to lose at least 3 but depending on what happens in the next few moves in some of your games I think 3 of your games could get really interesting.
Yeah, still potential for a couple interesting games. The way I'm playing though, I don't trust myself. Sadly I'd be happy with 2 wins at this point. But getting out is just not a thing and I feel like I let the SBR crew down lol
It definitely wasn't because of "pressure" but I for sure started playing worse this round, in addition to the strong competition. I've been a bit distracted by some irl stuff, I don't know if that has anything to do with it or not
I was just looking in on Section 2 and I must say it looks like Toptal is playing really well in virtually all of his games. But I'm particularly interested in blanko's game vs Toptal where blanko is Green. It's on move #25 right now, Purple to move. These next few moves have potential to be extremely interesting. I think Toptal could make a mistake within the next few moves or so. If he gets away with it might be impossible to beat him but if you catch it you might be able to take control of the game. This looks like it's going to be fun!
blanko Green Rd3 OA10 +2
*Toptal Purple Rd3 OA14 +4
*blanko Green Rd4 OA6 -4
Toptal Purple Rd4 OA6 -8
This game is great! blanko made Toptal pay for that weak Open 2 attempt on that lower right side and now this game is close!!
Looks like this Section isn't wrapped up just yet. I like blanko's chances in this game. Toptal has a pretty close game with Ryan and 2 close games vs urantian. It's entirely possible that everyone could go 3-3 in this Section. I'd still be fairly surprised if anyone goes winless or undefeated in this section.
Still doomed in my group but just scraped by in my purple game vs. urantian so I won't go 0-6. To date it's the strangest game I've ever won. I lost 4-2 on corners and he got the first 3. He's probably scratching his head about how he lost that one. I am too kind of
Winning games with 2 or less corners is always fun! I don't have many like this.
urantians openings are pretty slick but Greens moves #14 and #16 were terrible. You got away with some terrible moves of your own lol... but your move #28 was great. Once you gained a move there, I wasn't surprised that you won... but I was surprised at how it was done...
I don't know if you guys ever look at players stats but most of these guys have at least 10 times the Reversi related games experience than you guys do. urantian is currently playing in 8 different Reversi related Ladders alone. There's no shame in losing to guys like Toptal, Ryan, or urantian. With as little experience as you guys have just getting a win in a Section like this is impressive.
And to beat a guy like Toptal in a game and maybe going 2-2 against him in 4 games is damn impressive. This current game you have vs Toptal is fantastic! 4 OA each with 15 spots left on the board.
I've gone through a few different scenario's in this game and I would definitely rather be Green here. I'm curious to see how Toptal is going to attempt to win this game.
Last edited by JohnGalt2341; 09-22-20 at 07:48 PM.
Hm, I've looked at it a lot and I actually think Toptal is in the winning position if he makes the correct move on #34. I definitely might have overlooked something, could be something to discuss after the game's over
And if you can point out any of my terrible plays vs. urantian (or anywhere else) and why I'd appreciate it. Feels like I've seriously lost my mojo, but I might have just gotten too used to exploiting some of the weaker players and now I'm the one being exploited
One thing I'll say is, I've been making the very bad kind of unbalanced edges in some games because I just feel like I need to gain the move. Is that approaching it wrong and it's almost never worth it? I've been able to avoid unbalanced edges in a lot of games simply because I was in a solid position but that hasn't been the case lately and against stronger players
And for further reference about the Toptal game, I believe the correct move from him on 34 is b10. I don't see how I prevent him getting the entire top side of edges from there. But yeah, can discuss after the game so I'm not actually getting any direct ideas from you
Last edited by blankoblanco; 09-23-20 at 04:50 AM.
I'll do one game at a time and let's see what I find. This first one is where you are Purple. I went through the game here's some observations. urantian's openings are strong. I can see the Reversi style in his game.
Purple move #9
Beautiful smart aggressive play! Exactly where I would have moved. You took out a Key Piece of his that was touching 4 of your pieces. Anytime you can take out a KP4 like that while flipping in only one direction its usually a good move.
Green moves #14 and #16
Terrible
Purple move #19
I would advise against this. Normally I am all for the 3 move sequence that gains you a move while giving your opponent an Unbalanced Edge. But in this case I just think you were too eager with it. I would have filled up that upper right section first and once that section was filled you could do the 3 move sequence then and it would be far less dangerous. You got away with it though... so.. my hats off to you for that.
Purple move #24
Terrible. Before your move you weren't in any danger of getting an UE on that upper right side but now if Green takes that spot on the upper right wall you would have been forced to take it and get an UE and lose a move in the process. Either that or you will give up a corner. I would have played it differently starting at move #23 but your move was good as well but I would have taken that spot in the upper right on my next move to secure an Open 2.
Purple move #28
Nice! This move won you the game. After your move of #31 he was forced to give you some good moves.
Purple move #36
Terrible. I would have gone straight down to that lower left corner. Had this been a 25 Point challenge I think you would have got it but I know sometimes it's hard to see these things during a game. Especially when you are playing several games vs several good players at once. If you are ever undecided where you should move when it's near the end of a close game, on more times than not you're going to want to move into the sections with an Odd number of spots open instead of the Evens.
Purple move #38
Your move worked but I would have definitely approached if from the left hand side first. Nice work in this game. Aside from the mistakes I mentioned you played well.
Here's blanko's game vs urantian when you are Green and my observations.
Green move #4
I like it! You took out his most powerful piece on the board in that KP3
Green move #7
Another good power move!
Green move #8
I would have taken out one of his other KP3's instead like you did on move #10. Flipping pieces in only one direction is usually better than 2 or more directions.
Green move #20
I would have taken those 3 Purple pieces on the inside instead.
Green move #27
I don't advise this. I would have either taken that inside Purple piece on that left hand side or I would have tried to sacrifice that right corner.
Purple move #29
Terrible!
I'm nitpicking on some of these but just trying to give you an idea of how I would have played it. urantian played well in this game aside from move #29. Let me know if you have any questions.
Thanks for the feedback John, I appreciate the time you spent on it
For purple move #36, yeah that was just a complete miss by me, oof
Regarding KPs, does it not matter if they are 2 moves away from simply flipping it back? Attacking their KPs immediately just ends up working out?
Well, honestly I don't really know. The KP's are something that I just recently consciously realized how heavily I focus on these pieces. But I know there are plenty of times when I ignore some KP's but other times I focus on them very heavily depending on the game. I haven't figured out just yet how to articulate the difference between when I ignore them and when I don't.
I know in the beginning of many games, especially vs good players it seems like every move that you make can be countered by a better move from your opponent. This will usually happen more often when you are Green. I usually try to fight for position to get my opponents KPs and create KPs of my own but I don't know for sure that this is always the best strategy early on.
I'll probably look through your games vs Ryan tonight and I'm sure I'll find some moves where a KP should have been taken but it was not. And I'm sure I'll find plenty of good KP moves as well. I'll post what I find.
I'm always trying to figure out what gives me an edge over most players. For a long time I thought it was just because I understand how to play the sides better than most players. But now I am wondering if it is also because of how often I take out my opponents KP's.
Welp, it turns out I was missing something and you were right. I was half-right I guess -- there was no way to prevent him from getting the top corners and most of the edges. I just overlooked that I could win on pieces despite that
Is that pretty much what you were seeing? There were a lot of sequencing considerations for maximizing pieces in the endgame, I probably didn't even choose the best one
Another bizarre and unique game for me. Toptal will have the last 4 moves to himself. My part in the game is literally done. He just can't catch up. Never seen that one before. And if Toptal had played the end slightly differently, this could have been my first win with only a single corner piece
Reinforces the lesson that corners are only as powerful as the amount of control of the board they give you
Last edited by blankoblanco; 09-25-20 at 05:30 AM.
Below is blanko's game vs Ryan where blanko is Green. My observations are as follows:
Green move #7
Your move wasn't bad, but I would have taken that KP3+(the plus is the dead spot in the middle of the board) that was just left of the dead spot, flipping 2 pieces like you did on move #8.
Purple move #11
I would have taken the KP5 in the upper right part of the board.
Green move #12
These types of moves are really difficult to explain but I think it's moves like this that are probably one of the main reasons why you are struggling vs strong players. I would have moved just left and under where you moved, taking 4 Purples. OR taking just 1 Purple piece in that upper right part of the board would have worked as well and it might even be the better move.
On Purples next move he forced you into the 3 move sequence. You were right to take it but now you have to be really careful when moving over there because you might end up with an UE.
Green move #17
Again, your move wasn't bad but I would have moved to that middle lower part of the board taking 4 Purples. You would have also taken out two KP3's in the process. You moved there on your next turn and it was still definitely a good move, I just would moved there 1 move sooner.
Green move #20
I would have taken the KP4 on the lower right part of the board like you did on your next turn.
Boy... this game was tough. You didn't really make any terrible moves but Ryan played really well. What was particularly interesting to me and probably terribly frustrating for you was how well he did at blocking all or your good moves in this game. I can't say for sure that i would have won this game if I was Green. When Ryan plays well he can be very tough to beat.
Last edited by JohnGalt2341; 09-26-20 at 04:59 PM.
blanko is Purple playing Ryan
Purple move #9
Not Good. I would have taken the 1 Green on the lower right side of the Center Piece making a line of 5 Purples. OR Taking 1 Green on that lower left corner(not the spot touching the corner) would have worked as well I think.
Purple move #10
This move was a bit bold for my liking at this stage of the game. I would have moved in the same spot as I would have in the last move.
Purple move #13
This wasn't terrible but I would have taken the spot straight up from the CP(centerpiece) in the upper part of the board taking 3 Greens and taking out a KP4
Purple move #17
I would have taken out the 2 Greens in the middle lower part of the board for the next few moves until move #20.
Purple move #20
I would have taken the 1 Green piece in the lower right part of the board.
After that I think you were pretty much doomed. Aside from #9 none of the moves were particularly bad they were just too soon IMO. My main advice to you would be to just try to be more patient with playing the sides. In my recent Ladder game with Toptal(see post #112) neither one of us grabbed any pieces on the sides until move #20. The reason for this is because neither one of us really had any good moves on the sides(especially me).
Yeah, this is pretty rare indeed. I've lost games like this before though. I'll probably go over the entire game later but the main thing I would have done differently towards the end of the game was your move #35. I would have taken that lower left Purple piece so you would be threatening the lower left corner. This should guarantee you those 2 lower left spots for later. AND, it would have prevented him making his next move. I don't think you necessarily had to give up those top 2 corners in this game.
But you are going to win nonetheless. Congrats! I'm pretty sure that you have Toptal's respect now if you didn't have it after the first time you beat him. I'd be willing to bet that he probably thinks you've been playing Othello for years. I'll be curious to see if he challenges you in the Ladder now or if he avoids you.
I was going over a game from the last tourney where BBean played FGY and BB played super aggressive and FGY made a mistake on the sides allowing a C2(closed 2) when he could have forced an UE instead. It cost him the game IMO. But this was a really interesting game and it just goes to show you how even against super aggressive play one mistake could cost you the game.
Anyway, if you guys are interested it's a really interesting game IMO. I have to give props to BB for this because once you go all in on this plan you have to make sure you can get it or else you are usually doomed. It's not too common that I see aggressive play win like this but it does happen on occasion but I don't recommend ever playing like this.. And FGY is a really good player.
https://www.itsyourturn.com/pp?gm&g=...0629&t=3&gn=97
Last edited by JohnGalt2341; 09-26-20 at 10:12 PM.
Congrats to Daniel for winning the most games and winning the first 500! I paid your first post in this thread.In order to win the first 500 points you have to have the most wins of anyone from SBR besides myself.
He's at 9 wins and he's not done just yet.
I'm actually sort of hoping for a tie for first in that last division because I want to see how you would do against some of these other players.
Ryan and Toptal have a good one going and urantian has some very interesting games going here as well. I think he's got a pretty good chance of pulling at least 1 upset here. I'd love to see him pull a win vs Toptal.
Thanks!
I think I will get smashed in the finals. I hope I can win at least one game
Toptal and Urantian are really dragging here but I'm nearly certain that Toptal and Ryan are going to tie for first in that section.
The finals will almost certainly be the players below:
Daniel
Ryan
Toptal
Holden
This should be a lot of fun! Daniel's really got his work cut out for him here but making it to the finals in just your 2nd tourney is pretty damn good if you ask me.
I figure we have at least a week before the next round starts so... if you have any games you would like for me to review before the next round starts feel free to let me know.
OR, for blanko, if you have any more games or specific moves you would like for me to review, feel free to let me know.
It's funny how Toptal can sometimes lose to weaker players like myself and urantian, both of which Ryan dominated with ease, but then Ryan loses to Toptal quite convincingly. Clashes of style are real I guess?
Yeah, I was thinking the same thing. But my feeling is that although I do believe that Toptal is better than urantian and yourself, I think you guys are definitely good enough where you can hang with him and beat him far more often than your average player would be able to.
In one of Ryan's games vs urantian, I felt urantian was outplaying him but he made a mistake and gave up control of the game.
If you guys all ended up in the same section again in another tourney I think it would probably end up fairly close just like it was this time. I would still pick Toptal to win the section but I think I would still pick him to lose 2 games. And if he went undefeated in a Section like that I would be very impressed.
I fully expect to lose at least one game in the next round and it wouldn't surprise me if I lost 2 or more. I'm really hoping that Daniel can pull at least a win or two in the next round. If he doesn't, it's no shame. Ryan, Toptal, and myself have been playing this game for more than a decade and both Ryan and myself were in the finals of the very first Hexversi tourney.
This should be a lot of fun!!
I hope I can at least win one game!
Well, if you want you can take a look at the game I lost against Ryan, so I dont repeat the mistakes when we play again in the finals.
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