1. #1
    homie1975
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    Rafa v Joker debate for GOAT is very much alive and well................

    Some key stats mainly H2H:

    Slam totals: Joker 23, Rafa 22. small advantage Joker

    H2H overall regardless of venue: Joker 30 Wins, Rafa 29 Wins. small advantage Joker.

    Slams H2H overall: Rafa 11 Wins, Joker 7 wins. Big advantage Rafa.


    This debate is not closed by any stretch.

    Word is Rafa hip surgery went well and he should be back for 2024.

  2. #2
    DrunkHorseplayer
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    Joker is easily better than Nadal but McEnroe is the GOAT.

  3. #3
    homie1975
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    i am convinced now that JOKER took ALCA lightly due to already beating him at the FO 5 weeks ago and also JOKER's incredible run at Wimbledon.


    i am 100% convinced he took him lightly.


    just like 2015 vs WAWA in the FO Final.

  4. #4
    Conqueror
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    Quote Originally Posted by homie1975 View Post
    i am convinced now that JOKER took ALCA lightly due to already beating him at the FO 5 weeks ago and also JOKER's incredible run at Wimbledon.

    i am 100% convinced he took him lightly.


    just like 2015 vs WAWA in the FO Final.
    Having watched every minute of that match, I can say it's not a match that Alcaraz won. It's rather a match that Djokovic lost.
    Alcaraz is good and has many future slam wins in him but he's not yet on the same level as Djokovic.
    Since Djokovic might not participate in the US Open, I'd tip Alcaraz to win the US Open but Djokovic to win the next Australia Open and French Open, respectively.

  5. #5
    MoneylineExpress
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    RAFA the best clay court player. Djoker the best grass and hard court player. End of discussion. I'd argue Federer prime > Djoker prime on grass.
    Nomination(s):
    This post was nominated 1 time . To view the nominated thread please click here. People who nominated: trobin31

  6. #6
    homie1975
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    Quote Originally Posted by Conqueror View Post
    Having watched every minute of that match, I can say it's not a match that Alcaraz won. It's rather a match that Djokovic lost.
    Alcaraz is good and has many future slam wins in him but he's not yet on the same level as Djokovic.
    Since Djokovic might not participate in the US Open, I'd tip Alcaraz to win the US Open but Djokovic to win the next Australia Open and French Open, respectively.
    he certainly was yesterday and he is the 2023 WIMBY CHAMP

    see you in QUEENS

  7. #7
    homie1975
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    Quote Originally Posted by MoneylineExpress View Post
    RAFA the best clay court player. Djoker the best grass and hard court player. End of discussion. I'd argue Federer prime > Djoker prime on grass.
    all true

  8. #8
    slewfan
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    I do not think for a second Djokovic took the kid lightly. Djokovic at times was pressing and was huffing and puffing a little in the 3rd and 4th sets.

    If you want a conspiracy theory, here’s mine. The last time they met, the kid had cramps and could not play the match. It just happened to be the match which gave Djokovic the most wins.

    So they were guaranteed the to not meet each other until the finals at Wimbledon. The kid did not cramp up this time and won going away. That last set Alcatraz won a game 4 love with aces.

    Alcaraz is an outright phenom and Djoke is 16 years older. Djokovic is one of my favorites ever. But watching him smash his racquet was disturbing and I appreciated the + 170 for the bet..JMO.

  9. #9
    Conqueror
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    Quote Originally Posted by slewfan View Post
    I do not think for a second Djokovic took the kid lightly. Djokovic at times was pressing and was huffing and puffing a little in the 3rd and 4th sets.

    If you want a conspiracy theory, here’s mine. The last time they met, the kid had cramps and could not play the match. It just happened to be the match which gave Djokovic the most wins.

    So they were guaranteed the to not meet each other until the finals at Wimbledon. The kid did not cramp up this time and won going away. That last set Alcatraz won a game 4 love with aces.

    Alcaraz is an outright phenom and Djoke is 16 years older. Djokovic is one of my favorites ever. But watching him smash his racquet was disturbing and I appreciated the + 170 for the bet..JMO.
    Same here.

  10. #10
    Jayvegas420
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    Fed's the GOAT

  11. #11
    homie1975
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    Quote Originally Posted by slewfan View Post
    I do not think for a second Djokovic took the kid lightly. Djokovic at times was pressing and was huffing and puffing a little in the 3rd and 4th sets.

    If you want a conspiracy theory, here’s mine. The last time they met, the kid had cramps and could not play the match. It just happened to be the match which gave Djokovic the most wins.

    So they were guaranteed the to not meet each other until the finals at Wimbledon. The kid did not cramp up this time and won going away. That last set Alcatraz won a game 4 love with aces.

    Alcaraz is an outright phenom and Djoke is 16 years older. Djokovic is one of my favorites ever. But watching him smash his racquet was disturbing and I appreciated the + 170 for the bet..JMO.
    explain more please?

    it was a much much warmer day in France on that day 5 weeks ago than it was at Wimby yesterday.

    The kid gave up at RG so Novak could overtake Rafa with 23 slam trophies?

    where are you going with this?

  12. #12
    homie1975
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jayvegas420 View Post
    Fed's the GOAT
    so you bet against Joker because you are a FED fan more than just really thinking ALCA had a chance?

  13. #13
    Snowball
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    I'm really not sure how Joker would have fared in the "days before' big alloy racquets and baseline volleys.
    If he had a smaller wooden racquet and with the slower court speeds, how would he have done against yesterday's stars?
    We don't know but we DO know that Federer would have been just as good.

  14. #14
    MUHerd37
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    Djokovic the best all time

  15. #15
    slewfan
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    Quote Originally Posted by homie1975 View Post
    explain more please?

    it was a much much warmer day in France on that day 5 weeks ago than it was at Wimby yesterday.

    The kid gave up at RG so Novak could overtake Rafa with 23 slam trophies?

    where are you going with this?
    I believe, at this stage in his GREAT career, there is no way Djoko can beat the kid in 5 sets. Alcaraz threw the old man a bone and then gave him the smack down he should have 5 weeks ago.

    You do not have to agree and I am not asking you to. If you think sports are not corrupt at that level, then neither is politics.. Maybe..

  16. #16
    homie1975
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    Quote Originally Posted by slewfan View Post
    I believe, at this stage in his GREAT career, there is no way Djoko can beat the kid in 5 sets. Alcaraz threw the old man a bone and then gave him the smack down he should have 5 weeks ago.

    You do not have to agree and I am not asking you to. If you think sports are not corrupt at that level, then neither is politics.. Maybe..
    he gave away that much money to throw the match for Joker or was he paid off?

    big difference between making the semifinals and being runner up or champ

    What is the prize money breakdown for French Open 2023?

    Men's and women's singles

    Place Prize money
    Winner $2,496,039 (2,004,759)
    Runner-up $1,248,019 (1,002,380)
    Semifinalists $683,698 (549,130)

  17. #17
    lakerboy
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    Quote Originally Posted by homie1975 View Post
    he gave away that much money to throw the match for Joker or was he paid off?

    big difference between making the semifinals and being runner up or champ

    What is the prize money breakdown for French Open 2023?

    Men's and women's singles

    Place Prize money
    Winner $2,496,039 (2,004,759)
    Runner-up $1,248,019 (1,002,380)
    Semifinalists $683,698 (549,130)
    You think money is the biggest motivation for these guys?

    They will make so much. 600000 is peanuts for them. That's like $500 for the average guy in comparison.

    Legacy is what these guys are after. When you get into those money levels 600000 is a joke.

    Homie you should know this.

  18. #18
    homie1975
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    Quote Originally Posted by lakerboy View Post
    You think money is the biggest motivation for these guys?

    They will make so much. 600000 is peanuts for them. That's like $500 for the average guy in comparison.

    Legacy is what these guys are after. When you get into those money levels 600000 is a joke.

    Homie you should know this.
    4x more $$$ winning the French instead of making the semis and losing there.

    Alca would have surely beaten Ruud.

    i think it's a mega conspiracy theory to think he lost to Joker on purpose.

    even crazier to think he was paid off to do it.

  19. #19
    PharaohUB
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    Quote Originally Posted by Conqueror View Post
    Having watched every minute of that match, I can say it's not a match that Alcaraz won. It's rather a match that Djokovic lost.
    Alcaraz is good and has many future slam wins in him but he's not yet on the same level as Djokovic.
    Since Djokovic might not participate in the US Open, I'd tip Alcaraz to win the US Open but Djokovic to win the next Australia Open and French Open, respectively.
    If you think Novak wasn’t ready you don’t know tennis. The quality of the match suffered because of the windy conditions. It’s easy to say you’ve seen Novak play much better in different conditions. Alcarez is hell of a player and he may be in goat conversation by end of his career

  20. #20
    sunshineSpecial
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    Quote Originally Posted by Conqueror View Post
    Having watched every minute of that match, I can say it's not a match that Alcaraz won. It's rather a match that Djokovic lost.
    Alcaraz is good and has many future slam wins in him but he's not yet on the same level as Djokovic.
    Since Djokovic might not participate in the US Open, I'd tip Alcaraz to win the US Open but Djokovic to win the next Australia Open and French Open, respectively.
    That's what I thought too. He was playing defensively, but it seemed like he was concealing an injury or something.

  21. #21
    trobin31
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    I used to love watching Michael Chang dart around the court. He will always be my Bae

  22. #22
    jtoler
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    you left out the most glaring thing about nadal's major victories and h2h vs nole homie, but I'm sure it was just an oversight and not forgotten on purpose to make your idol seem even more god-like. you can't leave out that 14 of 22 major victories were on clay and 8 of those 11 wins h2h at majors were on clay where by consensus rafa is considered to be unbeatable at roland garros where he is 112-3 with 2 of those 3 losses by the guy in question, novak djokovic. nadal has beaten nole at every major except aus open. nole has beaten nadal at every major twice except us open where he's beaten him only once.

    nole has a nicer distribution of major wins and seems to be the better all around player when it comes to surface having won aus open 10 times, roland garros 3 times, wimby 7 times, and us open 3 times. while nadal has won aus open 2 times, roland garros 14 times, wimby twice, and us open 4 times. one thing nole has that nadal doesn't is an atp tour finals victory, nadal has never won the end of the year tourney pitting the top 8 against one another while nole has won it 6 times. one thing nadal has that nole doesn't is a gold medal at the olympics. nadal 94 titles, nole 92. nadal 1068 wins, nole 1064. nadal 134 mil prize money, nole 171 mil.
    Last edited by jtoler; 07-19-23 at 02:19 PM.

  23. #23
    Goat Milk
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    Quote Originally Posted by Conqueror View Post
    Having watched every minute of that match, I can say it's not a match that Alcaraz won. It's rather a match that Djokovic lost.
    Alcaraz is good and has many future slam wins in him but he's not yet on the same level as Djokovic.
    Since Djokovic might not participate in the US Open, I'd tip Alcaraz to win the US Open but Djokovic to win the next Australia Open and French Open, respectively.
    Nadal will be winning the next french open.

  24. #24
    Goat Milk
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    Quote Originally Posted by slewfan View Post
    I believe, at this stage in his GREAT career, there is no way Djoko can beat the kid in 5 sets. Alcaraz threw the old man a bone and then gave him the smack down he should have 5 weeks ago.

    You do not have to agree and I am not asking you to. If you think sports are not corrupt at that level, then neither is politics.. Maybe..
    Alcarez is not even as good as Djokovic right now. The guy played a perfect match and djokovic played one of the worst slam finals of his career and the kid barely won.

  25. #25
    shadymcgrady
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    Is rafa even better than Fed legacy wise? Are these guys like magic and bird and nole is Jordan?

  26. #26
    homie1975
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    Quote Originally Posted by shadymcgrady View Post
    Is rafa even better than Fed legacy wise? Are these guys like magic and bird and nole is Jordan?
    RAFA v FED

    Slams 22 to 20: advantage RAFA
    h2h all tourneys: 24-26. advantage RAFA
    h2h in slam venues: 10-4 advantage RAFA


    comments, questions, concerns?

    It is NOT even close.

  27. #27
    homie1975
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    Quote Originally Posted by trobin31 View Post
    I used to love watching Michael Chang dart around the court. He will always be my Bae
    he was tremendous.

    he was in some amazing matches and got the most out of small 5'9" frame but he was a beast and quite fast and strong.

  28. #28
    shadymcgrady
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    This was never a debate to begin with when the thread was made. Homie been eating djoker dikk for years now, he's fukking you til you luv him

  29. #29
    Enkhbat
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    I think Joker has proved that he is the GOAT

  30. #30
    ThaTopMoron
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    for years I liked Nadal and Fed over Novak but he is so damn hard to beat with the defense and ability to go to another level

    also liked that he didn't back down and get the jab just to play.... how many would he have right now if he got to play in the majors he missed? 25, 26?

  31. #31
    homie1975
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    Joker = GOAT right now.

    no doubt about it.

    however, Joker and Rafa still Unretired, so the debate is not 100% closed yet.

    only chance RAFA can reopen the debate IMO is if:

    - he wins two more Non-French Slams to tie Joker at 24 (must be Non-French slams IMO)

    - takes the lead on H2H record which is currently 30-29 slight edge Joker

  32. #32
    coop-dog
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    hes the goat and never took the clot shot, guy is the man
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  33. #33
    homie1975
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    Quote Originally Posted by shadymcgrady View Post
    This was never a debate to begin with when the thread was made. Homie been eating djoker dikk for years now, he's fukking you til you luv him
    Shady you were very quiet the evening of Sunday 7/16 when The Joker was dismantled in 5 sets by Carlito's Way.

    all of a sudden you are a big bold trash talker now (i knew it all along yada yada yada)

    this is clownshow type BS. you are better than this.

    GTFO

  34. #34
    DrunkHorseplayer
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    The debate is over, Joker > Nadal; the only question now is can Joker get to 30 majors.

  35. #35
    shadymcgrady
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    Quote Originally Posted by homie1975 View Post
    Shady you were very quiet the evening of Sunday 7/16 when The Joker was dismantled in 5 sets by Carlito's Way.

    all of a sudden you are a big bold trash talker now (i knew it all along yada yada yada)

    this is clownshow type BS. you are better than this.

    GTFO
    Well that's bc I had a bet on alcaraz. Besides I've been busy as hell lately but I can't resist stopping in and trolling the guys that take themselves more seriously than they should
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