1. 03-03-20 12:51 PM #1
    seaborneq
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    Biggest Beneficiary if Jordan nor Brady eras ever happened???

    Whose career is seen completely different if they don't have to deal will Jordan or Brady team greatness??

    Karl Malone and Patrick Ewing both probably have two rings if not for Jordan and both move into the top 2-3 of their positions all time.

    Big Ben and Peyton Manning probably move up to substantially if Brady is not in the way in the playoffs every year. Big Ben probably has 3-4 rings and Manning probably has 6 or more super bowl appearances and at least 1 more super bowl.

    Who else would have benefited from not being great during Jordan's and Brady's greatness.
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  2. 03-03-20 12:54 PM #2
    carolinakid
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    we would have more money in our pockets for not buying air jordans i guess........
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  3. 03-03-20 12:59 PM #3
    cincinnatikid513
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    malone stockton
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  4. 03-03-20 01:15 PM #4
    Chi_archie
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    I don't buy Stockton and Malone as much since they were western conference

    Remember Isiah Thomas and co had two back to back RINGS and 3 finals WITH Jordan in his Prime

    without him they had a great chance at a 3-peat. Maybe more


    Jordan typically had a pretty easy Eastern Conference Final when he got there, after finally figuring out the Bad Boys.

    there wasn't a lot of elite star power on good teams in his era.

    Thomas may have been the best
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  5. 03-03-20 01:21 PM #5
    shadymcgrady
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    Knicks get at least 2 chips, Ewing gets paid his final yr as a Knick, Riley stays and the team doesn't chase one bad decision after another.

    Riley never bolts for Miami and stern and the refs don't rob Cuban, nowitzki and the Mavs of a title when Wade got 67 free throws a game just by getting looked at on defense

    Rip Kobe, fukk stern spit on his grave
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  6. 03-03-20 01:31 PM #6
    Chi_archie
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    Quote Originally Posted by shadymcgrady View Post
    Knicks get at least 2 chips, Ewing gets paid his final yr as a Knick, Riley stays and the team doesn't chase one bad decision after another.

    Riley never bolts for Miami and stern and the refs don't rob Cuban, nowitzki and the Mavs of a title when Wade got 67 free throws a game just by getting looked at on defense

    Rip Kobe, fukk stern spit on his grave
    Knicks only played Bulls once in the Eastern Conference finals

    I'd pick Reggie Miller before Ewing
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  7. 03-03-20 01:34 PM #7
    lakerboy
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    Manning
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  8. 03-03-20 01:47 PM #8
    shadymcgrady
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chi_archie View Post
    Knicks only played Bulls once in the Eastern Conference finals

    I'd pick Reggie Miller before Ewing
    I'm surprised, you obviously lived in the era and remember it. We talking what ifs here, the Knicks don't break up after Jordans first retirement if it never happened.

    They win in the 91-92 season when Chicago beat them in 7 in the second round and then in the 92-93 season as well. Then after that no one leaves and the team doesn't break apart. Come on arch, get on grantland or the ringer and update your sports fanhood
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  9. 03-03-20 02:04 PM #9
    Cuse0323
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    Pacers probably have a title.
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  10. 03-03-20 02:11 PM #10
    pologq
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    1991, 1992, 1993 and 1996 the knicks do not lose to the bulls in the playoffs. 1993 is the only year they would have made the NBA finals directly.

    The Knicks would have had better records, wasted less energy during the regular season, etc. It really is a cumulative effect you can't predict.
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  11. 03-03-20 02:12 PM #11
    pologq
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    Quote Originally Posted by shadymcgrady View Post
    I'm surprised, you obviously lived in the era and remember it. We talking what ifs here, the Knicks don't break up after Jordans first retirement if it never happened.

    They win in the 91-92 season when Chicago beat them in 7 in the second round and then in the 92-93 season as well. Then after that no one leaves and the team doesn't break apart. Come on arch, get on grantland or the ringer and update your sports fanhood
    agreed

    knicks have a chance for a dynasty at that time
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  12. 03-03-20 02:15 PM #12
    lakerboy
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    Knicks were just great defensive team. They had the title on a platter vs Houston and lost
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  13. 03-03-20 02:32 PM #13
    shadymcgrady
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    Quote Originally Posted by lakerboy View Post
    Knicks were just great defensive team. They had the title on a platter vs Houston and lost
    What were the odds on that series? We're the Knicks favored?
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  14. 03-03-20 02:37 PM #14
    Golden fleece
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    craig ehlo and drew bledsoe
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  15. 03-03-20 02:47 PM #15
    habitualwinning
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    If were playin this hypothetical what ifs stuff, St. Louis probably still has an NFL team. The Rams lost to the Pats in the SB then the downward spiral began. Kurt Warner got dumped, the Rams fell off. There was no Greatest show on turf dynasty. Eventually they pack up and leave after years of futility. The Rams win that SB if not for Brady being great.

    The LA Rams win the SB last year too if Brady isn't great. So the Rams franchise would have at least 2 more SBs. Atlanta would have one also. The Raiders probably have another one too. Fukk what a deep what if scenario.
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  16. 03-03-20 02:48 PM #16
    asiagambler
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    Manning was 3-2 against Brady in the playoffs so I don't think he benefits the most
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  17. 03-03-20 03:00 PM #17
    RudyRuetigger
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    this has nothing to do with gambling
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  18. 03-03-20 03:01 PM #18
    asiagambler
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    Hard to say who benefits the most without Jordan. Jordan literally was gone for 1 year and mostly gone for another and no team really stepped up so Houston won 2 titles

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  19. 03-03-20 03:41 PM #19
    MinnesotaFats
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    Hakeem & company have the 6 rings

    The SD Charger w Tomlinson, etc or the Jets w that D they had under Ryan each get a ring or 2.
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  20. 03-03-20 03:49 PM #20
    johnnyvegas13
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    Big Ben would have another ring or two

    Not sure nba

    I guess jazz woulda won
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  21. 03-03-20 03:52 PM #21
    RudyRuetigger
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    Quote Originally Posted by johnnyvegas13 View Post
    Big Ben would have another ring or two

    Not sure nba

    I guess jazz woulda won
    if you get rid of the cheating from the patriots, steelers would have more, colts more....patriots probably 0
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  22. 03-03-20 03:54 PM #22
    DOM-Ganador
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    Rockets would have won a couple more. Hakeem a beast.
    Would have been nice if Patrick got one, ditto Stockton/Malone.

    NFL would have been a helluva lot different if TB AND BB never existed.
    Anyone who believes BB wouldn`t have made the Pats into a consistent contender without Tommy has very suspect intelligence. Or an irrational hater.
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  23. 03-03-20 04:28 PM #23
    RudyRuetigger
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    Quote Originally Posted by DOM-Ganador View Post

    NFL would have been a helluva lot different if TB AND BB never existed.
    Anyone who believes BB wouldn`t have made the Pats into a consistent contender without Tommy has very suspect intelligence. Or an irrational hater.
    he is a cheater

    sorry ill pass

    they should be treated like pete rose in baseball
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  24. 03-03-20 04:39 PM #24
    MinnesotaFats
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    Quote Originally Posted by DOM-Ganador View Post
    Rockets would have won a couple more. Hakeem a beast.
    Would have been nice if Patrick got one, ditto Stockton/Malone.

    NFL would have been a helluva lot different if TB AND BB never existed.
    Anyone who believes BB wouldn`t have made the Pats into a consistent contender without Tommy has very suspect intelligence. Or an irrational hater.
    Anyone know why Baltimore fired him before the move?
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  25. 03-03-20 06:39 PM #25
    seaborneq
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    Quote Originally Posted by shadymcgrady View Post
    What were the odds on that series? We're the Knicks favored?
    It went 7 so im sure the rockets should have been slight favorites
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  26. 03-04-20 08:01 AM #26
    lakerboy
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    Quote Originally Posted by shadymcgrady View Post
    What were the odds on that series? We're the Knicks favored?
    Houston-220. Knicks were up 3-2 going to Houston.
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  27. 03-04-20 08:06 AM #27
    lakerboy
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    Quote Originally Posted by asiagambler View Post
    Manning was 3-2 against Brady in the playoffs so I don't think he benefits the most
    2003/2004 no Brady and no 3peat. Manning wins both years and he won in 2006. Probably would've won in 2005 as well. Point is that he kept choking to Brady early on. If Brady wasn't there Manning would be undisputed greatest qb ever.
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  28. 03-04-20 08:12 AM #28
    Big Bear
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    Quote Originally Posted by seaborneq View Post
    Whose career is seen completely different if they don't have to deal will Jordan or Brady team greatness??

    Karl Malone and Patrick Ewing both probably have two rings if not for Jordan and both move into the top 2-3 of their positions all time.

    Big Ben and Peyton Manning probably move up to substantially if Brady is not in the way in the playoffs every year. Big Ben probably has 3-4 rings and Manning probably has 6 or more super bowl appearances and at least 1 more super bowl.

    Who else would have benefited from not being great during Jordan's and Brady's greatness.
    what a strange thread
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  29. 03-04-20 10:42 AM #29
    DOM-Ganador
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    Quote Originally Posted by RudyRuetigger View Post
    he is a cheater

    sorry ill pass

    they should be treated like pete rose in baseball

    The NFL's Biggest: Cheaters | Cheats

    What? You were expecting another team to top the list? Blame your local and national sports media for misinforming you. Click on a team's name to see all of their cheats or browse a list of the NFL's biggest cheats instead.
    TEAM
    CHEATSCORE?

    1. Denver Broncos

    (CheatScore of 53 = THE BIGGEST NFL Cheaters)

    2. New York Jets

    (CheatScore of 51 = ELITE NFL Cheaters)

    3. Indianapolis Colts

    (CheatScore of 48 = EXCEPTIONAL NFL Cheaters)

    4. Pittsburgh Steelers

    (CheatScore of 44 = WELL ABOVE AVERAGE NFL Cheaters)

    5. San Francisco 49ers

    (CheatScore of 37 = ABOVE AVERAGE NFL Cheaters)

    6. New York Giants

    (CheatScore of 37 = ABOVE AVERAGE NFL Cheaters)

    7. Baltimore Ravens

    (CheatScore of 35 = TOUCH ABOVE AVERAGE NFL Cheaters)

    8. Oakland Raiders

    (CheatScore of 33 = TOUCH ABOVE AVERAGE NFL Cheaters)

    9. Miami Dolphins

    (CheatScore of 31 = AVERAGE NFL Cheaters)

    10. Green Bay Packers

    (CheatScore of 31 = AVERAGE NFL Cheaters)

    11. Washington Redskins

    (CheatScore of 31 = AVERAGE NFL Cheaters)

    12. Atlanta Falcons

    (CheatScore of 30 = AVERAGE NFL Cheaters)

    13. Seattle Seahawks

    (CheatScore of 29 = TOUCH BELOW AVERAGE NFL Cheaters)

    14. New England Patriots

    (CheatScore of 27 = TOUCH BELOW AVERAGE NFL Cheaters)

    15. Detroit Lions

    (CheatScore of 27 = AVERAGE NFL Cheaters)

    16. Carolina Panthers

    (CheatScore of 27 = TOUCH BELOW AVERAGE NFL Cheaters)

    17. Tampa Bay Buccaneers

    (CheatScore of 26 = TOUCH BELOW AVERAGE NFL Cheaters)

    18. New Orleans Saints

    (CheatScore of 24 = BELOW AVERAGE NFL Cheaters)

    19. San Diego Chargers

    (CheatScore of 23 = BELOW AVERAGE NFL Cheaters)

    20. Minnesota Vikings

    (CheatScore of 23 = BELOW AVERAGE NFL Cheaters)

    21. Buffalo Bills

    (CheatScore of 23 = BELOW AVERAGE NFL Cheaters)

    22. Philadelphia Eagles

    (CheatScore of 22 = BELOW AVERAGE NFL Cheaters)

    23. Chicago Bears

    (CheatScore of 22 = BELOW AVERAGE NFL Cheaters)

    24. Dallas Cowboys

    (CheatScore of 22 = BELOW AVERAGE NFL Cheaters)

    25. Cleveland Browns

    (CheatScore of 20 = WELL BELOW AVERAGE NFL Cheaters)

    26. Kansas City Chiefs

    (CheatScore of 17 = WELL BELOW AVERAGE NFL Cheaters)

    27. Tennessee Titans

    (CheatScore of 17 = WELL BELOW AVERAGE NFL Cheaters)

    28. Houston Texans

    (CheatScore of 16 = HARDLY NOTICEABLE NFL Cheaters)

    29. Cincinnati Bengals

    (CheatScore of 15 = HARDLY NOTICEABLE NFL Cheaters)

    30. Los Angeles Rams

    (CheatScore of 15 = HARDLY NOTICEABLE NFL Cheaters)

    31. Jacksonville Jaguars

    (CheatScore of 13 = HARDLY NOTICEABLE NFL Cheaters)

    32. Arizona Cardinals

    (CheatScore of 12 = THE FEEBLEST NFL Cheaters)


    So Rudy my man, I am guesiing by your post that either:
    1) You believe this ranking is a Patriots conspiracy website
    2) No matter the facts, the Pats are dirt bags scumbags who had no talent or coaching proficiency and without cheating or luck they never would have won anything.

    Which NFL team are you a fan of?




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  30. 03-04-20 10:45 AM #30
    DOM-Ganador
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    Quote Originally Posted by MinnesotaFats View Post
    Anyone know why Baltimore fired him before the move?
    The Browns fired the entire staff because they are the Browns. I saw a good documentary with plenty of smart NFL guys who knew they were on the right path for success. A huge factor I believe was Belichick`s demeaner and handling of press. We know what that franchise has been ever since that period.
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  31. 03-04-20 12:43 PM #31
    seaborneq
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    Quote Originally Posted by lakerboy View Post
    2003/2004 no Brady and no 3peat. Manning wins both years and he won in 2006. Probably would've won in 2005 as well. Point is that he kept choking to Brady early on. If Brady wasn't there Manning would be undisputed greatest qb ever.
    This is true. Manning had some rough early playoff performances and getting manhandled by the Patriots had to leave doubt if he would ever be able to do despite his regular season greatness. Probably changes his trajectory if he beat them early versus beating them late. By the time the Colts played the Saints in the Super Bowl everyone knew Peyton was NOT unbeatable. Changed the percecption of his big playoff game mantra forever.
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  32. 03-04-20 12:49 PM #32
    asiagambler
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    Quote Originally Posted by lakerboy View Post
    2003/2004 no Brady and no 3peat. Manning wins both years and he won in 2006. Probably would've won in 2005 as well. Point is that he kept choking to Brady early on. If Brady wasn't there Manning would be undisputed greatest qb ever.
    As far as individual legacy, yes but I think you can make equally good cases for San Diego or Pittsburgh benefiting more
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  33. 03-04-20 01:45 PM #33
    Mac4Lyfe
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    Quote Originally Posted by MinnesotaFats View Post
    Hakeem & company have the 6 rings
    .
    Huh? The Rockets couldn't get out of the West. The Bulls weren't the problem for Houston. They routinely beat Jordan and the Bulls. Heck, Jordan wouldn't have the rings if the Rocket's could have made the Finals. They matched up really well with Chicago.

    Cleveland probably would have gotten 1 maybe 2 without Jordan and if they didn't trade Ron Harper like fools.


    The Browns would have had at least 2 if it weren't for John fukkking Elway.
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  34. 03-04-20 01:47 PM #34
    shadymcgrady
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    Forgot all ab the Brady part of the equation. Without a doubt Peyton would be regarded as a goat right now.

    GTFO Mac, lmao. Mark price, Brad Daugherty and Gerald Wilkins we're good but they weren't winning sht, Michael or no michael
    Last edited by shadymcgrady; 03-04-20 at 01:51 PM.
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  35. 03-04-20 02:07 PM #35
    Mac4Lyfe
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    Quote Originally Posted by shadymcgrady View Post
    GTFO Mac, lmao. Mark price, Brad Daugherty and Gerald Wilkins we're good but they weren't winning sht, Michael or no michael
    Shady, The Cav's got bounced 6 times to Chicago in those days. 87, 88, 91, 92, Cavs had the players to win it all but couldn't get pass the Bulls. Cavs had a great record vs the West during those days as well. My dad use to drive us to the sticks/country in Richfield to see all the home games. Ron Harper was the one guy that could actually slow Jordan down. Stupid Cav management traded him for injury prone Danny Ferry.
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