[Regul8er]

What do we think of the Raptors gentlemen?? They have all the pieces in place after the Rudy Gay trade. They got rid of an extremely inefficient ballhog, and replaced him with 3 solid bench players, that give the Raptors easily one of the top second units in the NBA. This is a very fun team to watch, Derozan and Jonas are growing up by the minute, Kyle Lowry should win December Player of the Month, and Amir Johnson is as solid in the block as they come. Couple that with a solid second unit, this team has a good shot of advancing to the East semis. They have beaten the likes of OKC, Dallas, NYK, Chicago all on the road in the last 2 weeks, and beat Indiana at home. Sure, you can be lucky, and win a game or 2 like that in a stretch, but not all of them. I'm a lifetime Raptor fan, and it's been a while since I've been this excited about the franchise.

[Regul8er]

And to top things off, they have cleared significant cap space for next season. If they could ever a semi star into the mix that wouldn't ruin the chemistry, this could be a dangerous team.

[Dollars2Donuts]

I agree with some of what you had to say, especially about the bench. I also think that before the Gay trade they were playing below their potential....soft in fact. It was actually hard for me to watch.

Since then Patterson and Vasquez have made them play tougher...who wouldn't around those guys. Lowry will always play better with another decent guard behind him, pushing him. Valenciunas cannot help but see the way Patterson (undersized) rebounds and plays with his elbows up. I also think that they are now reacting to the way that Hansbrough plays....he should have brought them some of the toughness they needed, but I don't think that they liked him....I think that Gay could have been one of those guys, creating a 'clique' and keeping them from really being a team that appreciates all of it's parts.

I doubt they add any player....and frankly if they do I think it would be a mistake. Wait for Derozan and Valenciunas to take another step or two, and maybe draft a player or two that turns out and they will have a shot in the East in the next couple of years because of their conference.

That all being said, this is a 10 game stretch. Even though some of these wins are killer, we all know that these teams, for the most part, took the Raps for granted.

[Regul8er]

Donuts.....I agree they won't add a piece this year, but they have the space where they would have the ability to possibly next year. Either way, I think this team has a legitimate shot of winning their 1st playoff series since 2000. Also, can't forget about Salmons, this guy is smart, and can be counted on to carry them for stretches when needed. Sure it's a bit of an over reaction, but the last few weeks make me think of what Indiana has able to build in the last 3 seasons. DeRozan is turning into a Paul George, maybe not quite the talent, but not too far back.

[bruins35]

man terrance ross has been playing great and hes still
very young

[Regul8er]

Thanks bruins....completely forget to mention Terrence Ross. He has put up some big numbers over the last 5 or 6 games. I don't bet Raptors games, but doesn't +3 at Washington seem like a pretty nice spot? Especially knowing they play at Miami and at Indiana their next 2 games, knowing they need a win here, or they could come home next week with an 0-3 trip.

[bruins35]

+3 sounds good should be a close game

[Dollars2Donuts]

Thanks bruins....completely forget to mention Terrence Ross. He has put up some big numbers over the last 5 or 6 games. I don't bet Raptors games, but doesn't +3 at Washington seem like a pretty nice spot? Especially knowing they play at Miami and at Indiana their next 2 games, knowing they need a win here, or they could come home next week with an 0-3 trip.

I am on TO tonight and have them teased as well. I am not sure if they win this game, but the way they are playing, the defense they are playing I cannot refuse the points in a matchup that I like. If nothing I think they make this very close.

[SolidAsStone]

I just had this discussion with a Raptors fan yesterday on the forum. I agree with you the Raptors are a decent team right now and are positioned well for the future. And they were definitely overlooked because of their record this season. I think after they beat the Pacers they got some respect, but I do not know if people think that game was a fluke or not. Either way the Raptors are no push over.

[Regul8er]

It's not just beating the Pacers though. It's winning at Dallas, and then winning at OKC the next night. I know NYK is down this year, but winning both games of a home and home handily, and then blasting the Bulls in Chicago for a 2nd time this season. Middle of the pack teams and bottom feeders don't this in a 2 weeks stretch.

[Regul8er]

They overcame double digit deficits against Dallas, OKC and NYK. Maybe I'm biased, but I think the light has flipped for some of these guys. Gay was a cancer, and they are finally starting to excel with him gone. I can't think of 3 PG's who have been better then Lowry this year.

[Vinnie Paz]

Raptors of the old would've folded up and died with those leads vs okc, indy. Big V has really come on love that dude. Don't sleep on Amir guy brings every ounce he's got every night

[Dollars2Donuts]

They overcame double digit deficits against Dallas, OKC and NYK. Maybe I'm biased, but I think the light has flipped for some of these guys. Gay was a cancer, and they are finally starting to excel with him gone. I can't think of 3 PG's who have been better then Lowry this year.

Well, yes....you are biased. Try not to be...it is tough, but you can do it. It took me years....but the last decade I look at others that sit around me cheering for 'our team', yelling at all of the bad calls (most were right) and it just makes me sad. The best fans are the ones that don't have their heads up their asses.

As for Lowry, he has been good.....but I can easily name 15 PG's in the NBA that I would rather have on my team. He has played well of late, but don't get carried away.

[Dollars2Donuts]

Raptors of the old would've folded up and died with those leads vs okc, indy. Big V has really come on love that dude. Don't sleep on Amir guy brings every ounce he's got every night

I agree...I just wish Amir weighed more than 27 ounces. Hasn't this guy ever heard of steroids??? I would still have him on my squad.

[Regul8er]

Donuts.....15 PG's that have played better then Lowry? I don't think you could name 10. I'd say he's going to get significant consideration for East Player of the Month in December.

[Regul8er]

Let me try.......Paul, Westbrook, Parker, Lillard, Irving, Wall....maybe Bledsoe and Lawson. I have a tough time going beyond them.

[bruins35]

rubio

[Regul8er]

Meh.....I find Rubio to be overrated. Doesn't have the shot or offensive game to ever be top tier. Obviously you could include Curry even though he's not a prototypical PG.

[Gopi-1]

Let me try.......Paul, Westbrook, Parker, Lillard, Irving, Wall....maybe Bledsoe and Lawson. I have a tough time going beyond them.

You could maybe add that guy they call Steph? You can also throw in DWill, Dragic, and Conley.

I see these 2 teams as mirror image of each other, and I like both teams chances of making the play-offs,
if they keep playing like they've been playing the past few games...

[Dollars2Donuts]

You could maybe add that guy they call Steph? You can also throw in DWill, Dragic, and Conley.

I see these 2 teams as mirror image of each other, and I like both teams chances of making the play-offs,
if they keep playing like they've been playing the past few games...

And then add in Jennings, Holiday and Teague as players that are all comparable talent-wise, but that I see more upside in, and you can see why I see him in the 15-20 range in PG's in the NBA. Also, Jose is still in this discussion as well....right in that same mix, even though I would prefer Lowry for now for the Raps.

I do agree....his last number of games he has been excellent....but a ton of that is momentum....ever since he hit that huge 3 to get to OT a couple of weeks ago he has played brilliantly....but he gets lost in his own head sometimes, and sometimes his motivation and drive take major steps backwards.

Everyone has they right to an opinion....and I understand that you think he is a top PG....but I have watched almost every game since he has been in TO, and I have seen the good AND the bad. I hope for the Raps sake that this isn't just a flash in the pan....my guess is that he is right in the middle....not as good as he has been playing, but better than he was the last few years.

I think that having Vasquez behind him has been HUGE. He is pushing him in games, pushing him in practice. Gervais will help to make Lowry better mentally, tougher, and give him sharper focus. I hope that the Raps manage to keep him around as Lowry needs a guy just like him.

[easyliving]

getting Gay was a mistake and Toronto did the right thing getting rid of him early as possible. Toronto has very solid guard play with Kyle lowry and Vasquez. If they can get a good offer for him i would consider trading away Lowry as I think Vasquez will do just as fine in the starting role. With that being said Brooklyn without a doubt will make a run eventually simply too much talent on that team not to win the division.

[rm18]

never gonna happen I am mush

Extra Bet for Bet Offer : NBA 2013/14: To win the Atlantic Division

Date	Time	Selection	Odds	Stake	Refund	Win	Status
Nov 23,2013	05:20	Toronto Raptors	+2000	1100.00	0.00	0.00	Pending

[Footballtime]

How about the PG he is going up against tonight J Wall? I think wall has been playing very very well...............

[bruins35]

man terrance ross has been playing great and hes still
very young

is playing unreal tonight

[Gopi-1]

With the way they're playing right now, winning the Atlantic will not be by accident...

[Menses]

Its the ball movement...that is making the difference. They showed flashes of this last year...they've always played defense but the assists were down when Gay started playing iso ball in the earlier quarters. Gay was a great in the 4th but his style of ball was a hindrance to team play. Not sure if we will keep Lowry as he could be packaged next year for Rondo...

[Dollars2Donuts]

Its the ball movement...that is making the difference. They showed flashes of this last year...they've always played defense but the assists were down when Gay started playing iso ball in the earlier quarters. Gay was a great in the 4th but his style of ball was a hindrance to team play. Not sure if we will keep Lowry as he could be packaged next year for Rondo...

Rondo would be a huge mistake with the makeup of this team IMO.

[lunch]

Not like Toronto is a scary team. Every team gets hot Raps will continue to suck and get screwed by the refs

[bruins35]

Not like Toronto is a scary team. Every team gets hot Raps will continue to suck and get screwed by the refs

just beat okc pacers knicks and wash on road that says something

[lunch]

just beat okc pacers knicks and wash on road that says something

look at that roster and tell me they have a chance

[bruins35]

look at that roster and tell me they have a chance

they have chance

[Regul8er]

Guys, do we realize that over the last 24 days, the Raptors are 9-3, with those 3 losses coming @ San Antonio, @ Miami and @ Indiana. Arguably the 3 best teams in the NBA, and the Raptors were in each game in the last couple minutes. This team is playing with a confidence and swagger that I haven't seen in a long time. It's going to be a fun season guys!

[d2bets]

Hosting the Milwaukee Sucks tonight.

[cala56]

I agree, and today will be a massacre in toronto. I Love this kind of threads.

[The Kraken]

Toronto is pretty good. Very underrated because they're not playing to their potential. They're a tall, lanky athletic team that can create matchup problems for lots of teams.