1. #1
    C-Gold
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    Phila Eagles defense has never been the same without Jim Johnson

    Guy just dropped dead right before the 2009/2010 season.

    Eagles had made the playoffs 7 out of the previous 9 seasons including 4 NFC Championship losses and 1 Super Bowl Loss. That's going to the championship over 50% of the time in 9 seasons. After he died the team made 2 brief wild card births and then missed the playoffs entirely 2 years after. The other schemes and coaches didn't work at all. The most ideal course would have been keeping one of his guys, Steve Spagnolou to keep the pressure going. Instead Todd Bowles and the dung heap offensive line coach were two of the worst coordinators I have ever seen. EVER. These Rooney Rule hires were so under qualified for the position it is sickening. It is an embarrassment to the NFL to see the Eagles trot those two losers out there and they cost Andy Reid his job.

    Jim Johnson wasn't successful because of talent, it was scheme. Pressure pressure pressure. Opponents had low QB ratings when they went to the Vet and to the Link. Opposing QB's might get that pass off but they understood they they were going to get hit by blitzing linebackers and even defensive backs.

    Johnson was famous for stacking defenders, he would stack 4 or 5 defenders to the right side where there were only 3 blockers. The left side of the line meanwhile might have 3 offensive lineman blocking 1 guy. It wreaked havoc on bad lines and inexperienced QB's. His defense got to take free shots at QBs. You'd think with all that blitzing they'd get beat deep a lot but it would happen a lot less than you thin.

    Jim Johnson was NOT all talent. How many Eagle defenders do you remember from all those years? Brian Dawkins, Hugh Douglas, Jermiah Trotter, Michael Lewis, Sheldon brown, Javon Kearse ... He didn't have the 2000 Ravens or 2002 Bucs, the guy had to plug and play linebackers because Eagles management is mostly cheap. The Redskins paid Trotter big bucks so you have to make due with what you have. Somebody else wants to pay Hugh Douglas so plug and play. The linebackers were never marquee. Even the CBs were seen as replaceable. The thing that never changed was Jim Johnson and a pure pressure zone blitzing scheme of punishing QBs.

    You can say what you want about Andy Reid but what destroyed this team was losing Jim Johnson, the Eagles never recovered. Their defense was pathetic last week. San Diego didn't kick their first punt until 5 min left in Q3. If Sam Diego didn't fumble twice inside the 10 yard line they could have put up 43-47 points. That's a west coast team at 10AM west coast time putting up big points on you at home. The coverage was so soft that Philip Rivers was 16/18 in the first half, yeah I am looking at you Carey Williams. Eddie Royal ran wild with 3 TD like he was Jerry F'in Rice.

    Vick had the 2nd best game of his life last week. With a Chip Kelly offense and horse shit defense you have to look at the Eagles over every single week until the books adjust. Part of it is Chip Kelly, the other part is the joke of a defense they push out there.

  2. #2
    You mad bro
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    Quote Originally Posted by C-Gold View Post
    Guy just dropped dead right before the 2009/2010 season.

    Eagles had made the playoffs 7 out of the previous 9 seasons including 4 NFC Championship losses and 1 Super Bowl Loss. That's going to the championship over 50% of the time in 9 seasons. After he died the team made 2 brief wild card births and then missed the playoffs entirely 2 years after. The other schemes and coaches didn't work at all. The most ideal course would have been keeping one of his guys, Steve Spagnolou to keep the pressure going. Instead Todd Bowles and the dung heap offensive line coach were two of the worst coordinators I have ever seen. EVER. These Rooney Rule hires were so under qualified for the position it is sickening. It is an embarrassment to the NFL to see the Eagles trot those two losers out there and they cost Andy Reid his job.

    Jim Johnson wasn't successful because of talent, it was scheme. Pressure pressure pressure. Opponents had low QB ratings when they went to the Vet and to the Link. Opposing QB's might get that pass off but they understood they they were going to get hit by blitzing linebackers and even defensive backs.

    Johnson was famous for stacking defenders, he would stack 4 or 5 defenders to the right side where there were only 3 blockers. The left side of the line meanwhile might have 3 offensive lineman blocking 1 guy. It wreaked havoc on bad lines and inexperienced QB's. His defense got to take free shots at QBs. You'd think with all that blitzing they'd get beat deep a lot but it would happen a lot less than you thin.

    Jim Johnson was NOT all talent. How many Eagle defenders do you remember from all those years? Brian Dawkins, Hugh Douglas, Jermiah Trotter, Michael Lewis, Sheldon brown, Javon Kearse ... He didn't have the 2000 Ravens or 2002 Bucs, the guy had to plug and play linebackers because Eagles management is mostly cheap. The Redskins paid Trotter big bucks so you have to make due with what you have. Somebody else wants to pay Hugh Douglas so plug and play. The linebackers were never marquee. Even the CBs were seen as replaceable. The thing that never changed was Jim Johnson and a pure pressure zone blitzing scheme of punishing QBs.

    You can say what you want about Andy Reid but what destroyed this team was losing Jim Johnson, the Eagles never recovered. Their defense was pathetic last week. San Diego didn't kick their first punt until 5 min left in Q3. If Sam Diego didn't fumble twice inside the 10 yard line they could have put up 43-47 points. That's a west coast team at 10AM west coast time putting up big points on you at home. The coverage was so soft that Philip Rivers was 16/18 in the first half, yeah I am looking at you Carey Williams. Eddie Royal ran wild with 3 TD like he was Jerry F'in Rice.

    Vick had the 2nd best game of his life last week. With a Chip Kelly offense and horse shit defense you have to look at the Eagles over every single week until the books adjust. Part of it is Chip Kelly, the other part is the joke of a defense they push out there.
    once teams adjust to that offense philly games will be boring as hell

  3. #3
    EaglesPhan36
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    Talent had quite a bit to do with it too. You don't win based on scheme alone. You can't even compare some of those Eagles teams on defense that made NFC Championship Games to what they had after Johnson passed. Dawkins-Lewis safety combo was lethal. Great corners.

    I think there's one thing that people don't talk about enough - Brian Dawkins. He left after 2008. Eagles have not had anything in the secondary to replace his leadership and ability since. They've had good DL since, decent corners at different times since - but safety has been a major void.

    Wiki
    Eagles defenders were selected for the Pro Bowl 26 times during Johnson's tenure. Former Eagle Brian Dawkins led the way with seven. Other Eagles defenders to go to the Pro Bowl under Johnson include Troy Vincent (five), Jeremiah Trotter (four), Hugh Douglas (three), Lito Sheppard (two), and Trent Cole, Michael Lewis, Asante Samuel, Corey Simon, Bobby Taylor (one each).

  4. #4
    C-Gold
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    Quote Originally Posted by You mad bro View Post
    once teams adjust to that offense philly games will be boring as hell
    Eagles/Chargers was the best game of the week hands down.

  5. #5
    You mad bro
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    Quote Originally Posted by C-Gold View Post
    Eagles/Chargers was the best game of the week hands down.
    i didnt see it .. for me it was watching the 49ers get crippled by the hawks lol

  6. #6
    EaglesPhan36
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    Quote Originally Posted by You mad bro View Post
    once teams adjust to that offense philly games will be boring as hell
    SD controlled possession and could not stop the offense. The offense is going to be the most consistent thing about this team if they stay healthy IMO. I don't think Chip has even shown his full array of formations/schemes on offense. Teams will try to mirror what SD did, but even with that - the offense scored 30 and should have had more. Eagles games will be high scoring shows unless a major cog gets hurt on offense or the defense suddenly "gets" the 3-4 scheme (don't see it).

  7. #7
    C-Gold
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    It's not all about talent. The Eagles were always known to "let a guy go a year early instead of a year too late". They'd let pro bowl guys like Trotter or Douglas go. Everybody thought they were cheap and crazy to do so. They were running a team in the style of the Patriots, letting guys like Branch, Seymour, Law, Vrabel etc. etc. etc. go.

    The Eagles were never the most talented team on defense. You don't need to be Bruce Smith or Reggie White to have 5 guys rush against 3 blockers. Even average defenders are going to pressure the QB. His mantra was I am going to stack and blitz more than you can block and it worked. Even if they didn't get a sack, they might get a tipped pass or a free shot on the opposing QB and that wears on the QB throughout the game.

    The Eagles defense since has had no creativity and no identity since then. Wide 9 and give up 150+ rushing yards on the ground? LOL, these coordinators were amateurs.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by EaglesPhan36 View Post
    SD controlled possession and could not stop the offense. The offense is going to be the most consistent thing about this team if they stay healthy IMO. I don't think Chip has even shown his full array of formations/schemes on offense. Teams will try to mirror what SD did, but even with that - the offense scored 30 and should have had more. Eagles games will be high scoring shows unless a major cog gets hurt on offense or the defense suddenly "gets" the 3-4 scheme (don't see it).
    San Diego didn't have to punt until their 8th or 9th possession which was with 5 min left in Q3. I believe they only punted 1 time in the entire game. Their receivers were wide open. Philip Rivers completed 16/18 in the first half. That was with King Dunglap as his LT in one of the worst offensive lines in the league. Rivers felt no pressure and was throwing passes to wide open receivers all game. You aren't worried? That defense was pathetic.

  9. #9
    EaglesPhan36
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    The hires for coordinator were terrible - all on Andy Reid. They still did not have anywhere near the talent of most of those JJ controlled defenses though. There's no way JJ could cover up the shit they have this year.

    They had a JJ-like game plan in week one. It worked for a half against Washington, but Chip sabotaged the defense with a piss poor 2nd half game plan on offense. They were on the field too much. That's part of what Chip has to adjust to as well. Balancing his fast paced offense with giving the D more rest.

    Their game plan against San Diego was not the same obviously because they did not get great pressure and the miscommunication in the secondary was laughable.

    Who said I wasn't worried? The defense sucks, there is no argument against that. Haven't even attempted to say they don't suck.

  10. #10
    You mad bro
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    Quote Originally Posted by EaglesPhan36 View Post
    SD controlled possession and could not stop the offense. The offense is going to be the most consistent thing about this team if they stay healthy IMO. I don't think Chip has even shown his full array of formations/schemes on offense. Teams will try to mirror what SD did, but even with that - the offense scored 30 and should have had more. Eagles games will be high scoring shows unless a major cog gets hurt on offense or the defense suddenly "gets" the 3-4 scheme (don't see it).
    idk man .. only thing chip kelly had with oregon is no competition ... you honestly think professional teams wont be able to adjust ?

    who knows ...

  11. #11
    Louisvillekid1
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    One of my all time favorite coaches,

    irreplaceable
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    This post was nominated 1 time . To view the nominated thread please click here. People who nominated: C-Gold

  12. #12
    C-Gold
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    Quote Originally Posted by EaglesPhan36 View Post
    They still did not have anywhere near the talent of most of those JJ controlled defenses though. There's no way JJ could cover up the shit they have this year.

    They had a JJ-like game plan in week one. It worked for a half against Washington,
    I disagree with these two points.

    Connor Barwin, Trent Cole on the outside and Ryans on the inside? That's a pretty damn good LB core.

    Fletcher Cox is a versatile lineman. Sop is just a big body.

    The secondary isn't good but if you play JJ style ball you can attempt to mask that and coach that. Were the corners ever really that great? The reason JJ corners got picks was because of all that pressure. Asante Samuel is a great gambling corner. Shelden Brown, you think he's any good? A lot of those guys were system players. It was all about that scheme.

    I don't say they had a good game plan in week 1, that was RG SHEET falling flat on his face. The guy couldn't run and couldn't hit open receivers. Here's a little secret, you take away the River rat's ability to run and he's not a very good QB. It is not RG3 can run, RG3 can throw like they say at ESPN. RG3 only completes throws because of the threat of the run. If he weighed 260 pounds and was a fat immobile QB you never would have heard of him, he'd be nothing without his legs.

  13. #13
    EaglesPhan36
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    Quote Originally Posted by You mad bro View Post
    idk man .. only thing chip kelly had with oregon is no competition ... you honestly think professional teams wont be able to adjust ?

    who knows ...
    I think you grossly underestimate his offensive schemes. They work. USC had some of the best defensive talent while Chip was at Oregon and he made them look silly every year. It will be next year before you can tell if teams will find a way to stop him. Given the span of one 16 game season, new/innovative offenses sustain success quite frequently. Look at the Redskins last year. The Broncos. And then there's the Patriots.

  14. #14
    C-Gold
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    Peyton Manning and Tom Brady already run the hurry up. They call a quick play if a defense tries to sub. These are the best in the biz and they are at the vanguard of a changing NFL.

    The stupid announcer said you needed a guy like Michael Vick to run the Chip Kelly offense, that's not true at all.

    In 5-10 years you should see hurry up offenses about as common as you see west coast offenses. They should be a regular thing.

  15. #15
    jjgold
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    Manning not getting plays off as fast as Vick

    Manning just using line of scrimmage as his huddle

    All Phila has to do is blitz more///Gates is a fukkin animal on SD..nobody every really stops him

    Rivers a real Pro QB

    Things will be different Thurs

  16. #16
    dirtyphils
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    Third down defense and the secondary are the weak links in the chain.

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