[hoopster42]

Huh? What does Odum committing two boneheaded mistakes in the span of about 10 seconds which cost the Lakers the upset have to do with Vlade and Portland?

Phil even told him to foul in the timeout previously and the dummy forgot.

you're saying the lakers would have beaten the suns IF.....

and i'm saying the trailblazers beat the lakers IF they take care of the ball or hit a few shots with a 12 pt lead mid-4th quarter

and i'm saying that the sacto kings take a 3-1 lead IF vlade grabs the ball instead of throwing back inbounds trying to save it and it goes right to robert horry for the 3-pter

IF, IF, IF, IF

the lakers have gotten unlucky once this decade on the IFs but have gotten lucky TWICE

[daggerkobe]

You're comparing Odum's idiotic mental lapses (two in 10 seconds) to Vlade tapping the ball because he was off balanced and the Lakers erasing a 24pt deficit?

[BCaldwell32]

You're right Nicky.

Jokedon was the most overrated of all time.

Just look at the facts without another Hall of Famer playing next to his side:
•43% win percentage
•Never advanced past 1st rd
•Only won 1 playoff game
•Swept out of 1st rd 2 of 3 playoffs
•Couldnt win a single playoff game with "Iceman" George Gervin playing along side him
•No MVP
•No Title


Pippen without Jokedon led the Bulls past the 1st rd. Led the Blazers to the conf finals which Jokedon could never do without Pippen.

Oh my god, this is the stupidest post I have ever seen in my life!!! Jordan could not win anything in the 80s because he had no team whatsoever and he only had to play against one of the best teams ever to step on the floor in the Celtics. He also had to play against another insanely good team in the Detroit Pistons and there were other great teams in the Eas back then also. You can be 5 times as good as Jordan was and there is no way you can beat the 80s Celtics or Pistons by yourself, it is just not possible.

[hoopster42]

80s were pretty much watered down also. Other than the Lakers & Celtics who were great? Which explains why they combined for 8 championships in the 80s.

And if you thought the East was bad now...... the Bulls made the playoffs with a 30-52 record one season! Couldnt do that today.

Kobe averaged 35PPG against western foes which were tougher and had to have a winning record to make the playoffs unlike Jokedon of the 80s when 30 wins were enough to make the playoffs.

once, the bulls made the playoffs ONCE with that record, it was a down yr in the east. the lakers and celtics won so many championships because only 1 team can win each yr and in a best of 7 format the best team pretty much wins every yr, the lakers and celtics have multiple hall of famers on each team and were by far the best teams

in the east, aside from the celtics obviously, the sixers were awesome in the 1st half of the decade, the hawks were good w/dominique and willis, the cavs were good with daugherty and harper, detroit was good even before winning those championships in 89-90, the knicks had good teams, even washington with bernard king had good teams

in the west, aside from the lakers obviously, the nuggets had good teams every yr, the suns were good, the sonics, the dallas mavs were really good as was utah, houston had hakeem and sampson who were so tough......

nba basketball the latter half of the 80s was absolutely incredible and was a golden age of nba hoops, ask anyone who has followed for any length of time and they will agree, it was the freaking golden age of the nba

[BCaldwell32]

lol put the raiders in college and they win National championship every single year for the next 1000 years and same with Sacramento. People are so clueless it is no wonder why the economy has gone down the toilet, just complete morons in this country!!!

[daggerkobe]

Bulls made the playoffs with a 30-52 record and 40-42 another season.

East of today is definately tougher with far more parity. Celts with the 3 amigos; Cavs with Lebron; Magic with Howard; Heat with Wade; Sixers with AI; Nets with Vince; Wiz with Gilbert; Pistons with Rip..... All these teams are capable of advancing deep into the playoffs and not a cakewalk whatsoever as we saw this season. More paritu means more competition every game and every playoff series. It's no longer 1 team like the Celtics dominating and no more 30 win teams making the playoffs.

The West has always been tough as I dont recall a 30 win team making the playoffs let alone any team under .500.

[jjgold]

They are fairly close but Jordan was better

If Kobe gets to 6 titles then we will re evaluate

[Nicky Santoro]

On behalf of SBR committee, i'd like to congratulate Daggerkobe, as being the most knowledgeable and ONLY knowledgeable guy in this thread.

The rest of you know nothing.. he's the only one that knows Kobe is better MJ..

congrats dags.. and to the rest of you.. go read some basketball books or at least go watch more games.. you might learn something..

best player ever

1- Kobe
2- Jordan
3- Wilt

[CashMoney]

MJ
6-time NBA Champion
6-time NBA Finals MVP
5-time NBA MVP
7-time The Sporting News MVP
10 NBA Scoring Titles
14 NBA All-Star Selections
3-time NBA All-Star Game MVP
11 All-NBA Selections
9 All-Defensive Selections
NBA Rookie of the Year – 1984
NBA Defensive Player of the Year – 1988
NBA Slam Dunk Contest Champion – 1987, 1988

KOBE
3-time NBA champion
6 NBA Finals appearances
1-time NBA Most Valuable Player
2-time scoring champion
11-time NBA All-Star
3-time NBA All-Star Game MVP
11-time All-NBA selection
9-time All-Defensive selection
NBA All-Rookie selection
NBA Slam Dunk Contest champion: 1997

MJ it is..........

[Chi_archie]

MJ is gonna be hard to beat

[flyingillini]

MJ

[Thor4140]

All i know it is that is about time that Lebron James isn't even in this discussion. Guys are finally starting to smarten up.

[pavyracer]

Kobe Bryant is not even the best Laker ever. How can he be better than Jordan?

[WileOut]

I did not read any post but pavy's above. No way in hell is Kobe better than Jordan. First of all, at this point in his career, Kobe is not nearly as athletic as Jordan was at the same age. Jordan was just getting started at 30, Kobe is losing a step every game.

These 2 things will prove that Jordan is better than Kobe.

Jordan won 6 titles with teams not even close to as good as the teams Kobe has played on. Jordan's teams had no inside presence at all. In his prime there was no question that Jordan and the Bulls were the best player and best team. This year, the Lakers were not the clear cut best team. Its not due to better competition either. If Garnett had not gone down, the Celtics may have won it.

Look at the numbers. Jordan shot 50% lifetime, 33% from 3 range, 84% free throws (these stats were way higher before his 2 years with the Wizards). He was defensive player of the year in 1988. 9 time all NBA defensive player. 11 time all NBA. 10 scoring titles. 6 time finals MVP. 5 time NBA MVP.

Kobe is nowhere CLOSE.

[unde0087]

I am not kidding.... if Kobe had the players Jordan played with and let Jordan play with crap like Odom, Fisher, Walton, Kobe would have been known as the greatest ever.

he's simply amazing..

who did Jordan have? Pippen, which is another Odom. If Kobe was so great the Lakers wouldnt have been destroyed in the finals last season. I don't remember a Jordan lead team ever losing by 30+ in a finals elimination game. Even when teams double teamed Jordan he still scored, he didn't turn the ball over and then cry to the refs that he was fouled.

Jordan was and is the greatest player ever, he still will be when Kobe and LeBron have come and gone.

[frostno98]

Who ever started still thread must be a clueless moron as this is a clueless thread.

MJ it is!

[lakerboy]

this is funny shit man Nicky- props for starting this thread. Your points have validity and Kobe isnt even done yet. hoopster sounds like he might die soon by the way he has gone nuts in this thread

[Nicky Santoro]

this is funny shit man Nicky- props for starting this thread. Your points have validity and Kobe isnt even done yet. hoopster sounds like he might die soon by the way he has gone nuts in this thread

you noticed that too, huh? don't you love the way this kid is going nuts here. i dont know why he can't admit that kobe is much better than MJ..

jordan is the 2nd best player in nba history, right behind Kobe Bryant..

Kobe is simply amazing..

[tacomax]

On behalf of SBR committee, i'd like to congratulate Daggerkobe, as being the most knowledgeable and ONLY knowledgeable guy in this thread.

You know you're on the wrong side when GummyKobe is the only one backing your point of view.

[lakerboy]

you noticed that too, huh? don't you love the way this kid is going nuts here. i dont know why he can't admit that kobe is much better than MJ..

jordan is the 2nd best player in nba history, right behind Kobe Bryant..

Kobe is simply amazing..

the problem is that nobody will contemplate talking about jordan comparisons cause its a unwritten rule that he was the greatest ever. last night watching kobe made me think about it for the first time ever and you know what kobe is a better jump shooter and he is JUST starting another run with this team and thats what is really killing all these kobe haters. i dont have time for hoopster and his research and all that crap. i saw magic, jordan, bird and all the greats since 1980 and kobe is right there. hoopster once argued with me about lebron and kobe so you know he would argue this for sure. i just hope he doesnt have an anxiety attack i worry about that guy he really is too into it- and please stop comparing teams it cant be answered and if kobe wins 7 rings in the end will that make him better

[Nicky Santoro]

lakerboy, i can tell by reading your post that you know your basketball, unlike hoopster. poor kid doesnt know much.. i can't believe this kid thinks MJ was better than Kobe is.. unreal..

[texhooper]

Kobe Bryant is not even the best Laker ever. How can he be better than Jordan?

HA!!! perfect!!

how about we start a kobe vs jerry west thread??

jerry west was so good he actually made it into richard pryor's early standup. earmuffs, please.

"n***** and white people be fightin', i always root for the n****, even if he bad. please whoop the white folks. i don't want white folks to win nothin'. even jerry west...i wish that mother****er couldn't play basketball. cuz that mother****er can PLAY some basketball. i seen him make n***** look ridiculous. i mean, n***** be out here, jerry done made 22 points. it's embarrassing, you know."

throw stats out the window, richard told us a long time ago how good this man was.

[reno cool]

everybody knows Kareem was the best ever. Oh and Sabonis. Iceman was the baddest though. And how about Dr. J?

[Buckeye]

Kobe is as close to a player that approaches MJ in then NBA since the Jordan era! The game he had last night was amazing! That being said Jordan never lost in the NBA finals and I will leave it that!

[reno cool]

When Jordan came into the league the game went to shit. And remains shit to this day. Dominique was the one who started it though.

[Trixie]

To postulate that Kobe is better than Jordan is so ridiculous that I have to assume you're just trying to piss people off. Ignoring everything else, Jordan won more championships with a weaker supporting cast, against more competitive teams.

[texhooper]

everybody knows Kareem was the best ever. Oh and Sabonis. Iceman was the baddest though. And how about Dr. J?

yeah, i agree, but there are no richard pryor bits about them. part of what i was saying is that every era has ridiculous players that sometimes get lost in the shuffle, even players that transcended barriers like race relations and whatnot. kobe is on the ridiculous players list, but we as a society are so quick to start up the mj v whoever debate because he's the most recent guy who got a real consensus amongst the public and the nba vets as the greatest ever. it's just too soon to start that kind of a monumental discussion again, because it invariably ends with "just wait until XXXX hits their stride and starts snatching up rings."

[BigMoneyMan]

I am not kidding.... if Kobe had the players Jordan played with and let Jordan play with crap like Odom, Fisher, Walton, Kobe would have been known as the greatest ever.

he's simply amazing..

YOUR A STRAIGHT UP DUMBASS. Lebrone, tough i despise him is the best all around player. Michael on offense and a beast on the D. Last time Kobe or MIchael blocked a shot

[tsn101]

Kobe doesn't even have a back to the basket game.

[lakerboy]

Kobe doesn't even have a back to the basket game.

that is a truly stupid statement- the guy can play it anyway you want it- wasnt pietrus god against cleveland did you see what kobe was doing against him last night

[The_Kid]

Kobe doesn't even have a back to the basket game.

WTF?

[BigMoneyMan]

that is a truly stupid statement- the guy can play it anyway you want it- wasnt pietrus god against cleveland did you see what kobe was doing against him last night

What up G? Kobe, Jordon, and Lebrone all have the speed to the hole and the fade away shot. But Lebrone has the D. Have to admit. I lost al respect for him but facts are facts.

BTW That face Kobe was sporting a little weird.

[unde0087]

Kobe himself would say that he isn't as good as jordan. To me they are both great players, but did you see Jordan blame his team and throw temper rants if things didn't go his way like Kobe has in the past couple of years? Kobe is the biggest baby in the game when things aren't going right for the Lakers. Many teams have played Kobe rough and then he cries to the officials and whines like a baby on the bench when he is out of the game. Jordan was a leader and a coach on the floor, he didn't have to change years into his career. I don't know maybe it is just me but if there was a couple seconds on the clock I would take Jordan in his prime over anyone. The guy was amazing, Kobe puts on quite a show and can take over games but like I have said before, this goes to show how as years pass people forget how good older players were and worship players now.

[BigMoneyMan]

that is a truly stupid statement- the guy can play it anyway you want it- wasnt pietrus god against cleveland did you see what kobe was doing against him last night

Don't get crazy with the peons. You know why LA won last night IMO.(and shot well) Pm me G. LAter

[lakerboy]

What up G? Kobe, Jordon, and Lebrone all have the speed to the hole and the fade away shot. But Lebrone has the D. Have to admit. I lost al respect for him but facts are facts.

BTW That face Kobe was sporting a little weird.

he looked like a shark ready to bite someone- is that supposed to be his answer to jordans tongue lol