[mathdotcom]

Wins

Even jjgold would've gotten a few wins with those bats behind him

[NYSportsGuy210]

Wins

Even jjgold would've gotten a few wins with those bats behind him

Math.com you have yet to grasp the concept of Capitalism on a macro level how are you gonna argue HOF numbers now.

[mathdotcom]

Math.com you have yet to grasp the concept of Capitalism on a macro level how are you gonna argue HOF numbers now.

Still waiting for you to give me the name of the macro textbook that says you need inequality for capitalism to work

Can't find it can you?

How many wins do you think Verlander would get pitching for the Cubs this year? And how many with Detroit?

[BAUS]

Steve, how about Tommy John?

26 Seasons, 288 Wins, 3.34 Career ERA.

BAUS

[NYSportsGuy210]

Still waiting for you to give me the name of the macro textbook that says you need inequality for capitalism to work

Can't find it can you?

How many wins do you think Verlander would get pitching for the Cubs this year? And how many with Detroit?

You are so out of your league in arguing with me you can't even write the correct thing I am saying inbred.....

[NYSportsGuy210]

Bottom line for this thread is that Mike Mussina is Hall of Fame worthy (though not first ballot) and a more intruiging argument would be for Andy Pettitte's consideration.

[mathdotcom]

You are so out of your league in arguing with me you can't even write the correct thing I am saying inbred.....

Let me guess, you have a degree in history or poli sci from a liberal arts college

[paranoyd androyd]

No. Not even close.

[NYSportsGuy210]

Let me guess, you have a degree in history or poli sci from a liberal arts college

Finance and astronomy dummy.

[mathdotcom]

Finance and astronomy dummy.

!!!!!!!!!

[mathdotcom]

Thread over

[Br0nxer]

no

100+ more wins then loses. impressive

not hall of fame impressive
hall has numbers they go by

300 wins

500 homers-pre steroid era

very hard to get in if you don't hit the magic number

[yisman]

jamie moyer belongs in the hall of fame because if he wasn't on the phillies they never would of won the world series, he's pitching in his 50's, played for alot of bad teams and u just don't always base everything on stats alone. Don't care if others have more k's or whatever, doesn't matter

so he pitched a long time, that makes him a hall of famer?

[ttwarrior1]

nope , that plus wins, plus longevity, world series, prestige, charisma, etc

He'll be 70 by then, lucky if we are alive then

[will2survive]

having a 20 win season in his last year is huge. That put's him into the conversation. I always like for hall of fame to be elite and Mussina wasn't "elite". His ERA is better than Pettittes but when it come's to big games and winning, I'd rather have Pettitte at the mound.

[gryfyn1]

having a 20 win season in his last year is huge. That put's him into the conversation. I always like for hall of fame to be elite and Mussina wasn't "elite". His ERA is better than Pettittes but when it come's to big games and winning, I'd rather have Pettitte at the mound.

Well is ends up being very hard to tag him as elite, mainly because he pitched in in era that contained 4 of 10 best pitchers of all time.

so he pitched a long time, that makes him a hall of famer?

it got Blyleven in

[yisman]

so he pitched a long time, that makes him a hall of famer?

nope , that plus wins, plus longevity, world series, prestige, charisma, etc

He'll be 70 by then, lucky if we are alive then

I said he pitched a long time and you say that plus longevity. He won one World Series in 26 years, so that would hardly be a reason to put him in.

Charisma is irrelevant.

it got Blyleven in

Blyleven never should've gotten in. He hung around on the ballot for ages until they finally capitulated due to a lack of quality candidates that year.

[PedroG]

Lets look at another Key stat that nobody has brought up about the Moose , Ks to walks ratio. Whereas Moose ranks 16th all time with a 3.58 ratio. Doesnt matter where you play or who bats for you , bottom line is for Mooses career he threw 7 strikeouts for every 2 walks he allowed.

He has a higher K/BB ratio than all of the big name pitchers in the 1990s , Maddux, Clemens , Randy, Smoltz, Moose beat em all ....

Obv this alone wont get him in , but the 270 wins , the 120+ era , the .638 winning % . and the 7/2 K walk ratio ... to be shows he belongs in that elite class

( i was kidding about Cone , although he is one of my all time favs )

[Griffey4Ever]

I am interested to hear your take on Andy Pettitte and if he is a HOF candidate?

Despite have almost 30 less wins than the Moose, Andy Pettitte will get in. Hard to deny a 5x World Champion his place in the Hall of Fame.

Then again, Pettitte has tainted his career with his multiple comebacks and steriod allegations.

[stevenash]

Lets look at another Key stat that nobody has brought up about the Moose , Ks to walks ratio. Whereas Moose ranks 16th all time with a 3.58 ratio. Doesnt matter where you play or who bats for you , bottom line is for Mooses career he threw 7 strikeouts for every 2 walks he allowed.

He has a higher K/BB ratio than all of the big name pitchers in the 1990s , Maddux, Clemens , Randy, Smoltz, Moose beat em all ....

Obv this alone wont get him in , but the 270 wins , the 120+ era , the .638 winning % . and the 7/2 K walk ratio ... to be shows he belongs in that elite class

One advanced scout said "When Mussina's overhand curve ball was 'on' it's the most devastating pitch in the game"

One GM once said "If Mussina walks you, it's by design"

[stevenash]

Then again, Pettitte has tainted his career with his multiple comebacks and steriod allegations.

No allegations, he said he took them, once, with a doctors prescription, took them to help heal an injury, once again, prescribed by a doctor, which he proved to MLB.

There's a reason why he's not lumped in with the Sosa's, and Canseco's of the world, because even though he came up dirty once for steroids, it was for medical reasons, not to gain an advantage.

The suits on Park Ave even verified that.

[BuddyBear]

I am interested to hear your take on Andy Pettitte and if he is a HOF candidate?

No. He would have the highest ERA ever of any pitcher in the HOF. His inflated win total is the benefit of having played on very good teams that scored lots of runs behind him. Also, he admit to using steroids.

What he does having going for him is 1) Most of the HOF voters are stupid and only look at W/L record, 2) He played on the Yankees, 3) He was a historically good post season pitcher, 4) He did not deny using steroids and fessed up to it and that scored him a lot of points with the public.

See what happens next year with Roger Clemens and you'll have a good idea whether Pettitte even has a shot.

[mh217]

Fukk the hof until they put Charlie hustle and Donnie baseball in there.

[Doug]

Moose and Pettitte both belong !

[NYSportsGuy210]

Pettitte was so clutch in the post season is one of the major reasons why I brought him up in the discussion. Now who is to say he doesn't pitch well this year and perhaps next and even adds 25 more wins to his career totals as well? That would make him even more relevant along with his 5 WS rings too.

[NYSportsGuy210]

Fukk the hof until they put Charlie hustle and Donnie baseball in there.

Mattingly and Bernie Williams to me aren't Hall of Famers. The only current Yankees over the last 25 years I like to get in are Mariano Rivera, Jeter, A-Rod and Pettitte is a toss up.

[stevenash]

Mattingly and Bernie Williams to me aren't Hall of Famers. The only current Yankees over the last 25 years I like to get in are Mariano Rivera, Jeter, A-Rod and Pettitte is a toss up.

Mo and Jeter are first ballot, close to unanimous first ballot, A-Rod will get in, but will be punished by the voters before getting there, Pettitte, love the dude, but he'll fall short.

[gryfyn1]

Pettitte was so clutch in the post season is one of the major reasons why I brought him up in the discussion. Now who is to say he doesn't pitch well this year and perhaps next and even adds 25 more wins to his career totals as well? That would make him even more relevant along with his 5 WS rings too.

Pettite was highly overrated for his post season performance, he benefited mostly form pitcher for extremely good teams and making lots of starts.

But he made 42 starts, posted a very average 61.9% QS%, never pitched a complete game, stuck out just 5.9 per 9 innings posted a 1.30 WHIP, a very average 3.83 ERA and a poor 4.17 FIP. and in his 12 WS starts his numbers are worse.

He did have some very good starts in big games, but he had just as many if not more stinkers.

[InTheDrink]

the hall of fame is shit with guys like blyleven and jenkins getting in

fuk it....throw him in...he was a runner up for cy young one time in his career....guy is fukkin amazing!

and anyone who really thinks pettitte should be in should be banned from every sports board on the internet