[will2survive]

Of course he's a 1st ballot hall of famer. A lock. He's a Yankee legend and 4 time World Champion

[Bob Loblaw]

Look at Miguel Tejada's 10 year stat sheet starting from 2000

.275, 30 HR, 115 RBI
.267, 31 HR, 113 RBI
.308, 34 HR, 131 RBI
.278, 27 HR, 106 RBI
.311, 34 HR, 150 RBI
.304, 26 HR, 98 RBI
.330, 24 HR, 100 RBI
.296, 18 HR, 81 RBI
.283, 13 HR, 66 RBI
.313, 14 HR, 86 RBI

That's batting in a weak lineup in Oakland and being the man in Baltimore, and that's not having A-Rod behind you in the lineup protecting you. Miguel Tejada also helped the Giants win a Championship last year. Now now many endorsements did he have? How much media attention did he get in the last 10 years? Who is talking about Miguel Tejada to the hall of fame first ballot or not? Even when Tejada fell of and was hitting .296 18 HR he was very Jeter-like, but when he was in his prime he was hitting .311, 36 HR and 150 RBI.

Jeter had every advantage in the world and is probably the most overrated player of all time in any sport. He's hyped out of the stratosphere and that doesn't even take into consideration he's probably one of the 5 worst defensive shortstops in MLB. He'll make the plays that come right to him but nothing more as he has the range of a grandma.

Miguel Tejada was also highly believed to be using steroids while Jeter is highly believed to have always been clean. Big difference.

Tejada may have had better individual years at times but Jeter has had the better career without question.

[VegasInsider]

Tejada was on the juice, let's not forget that.

Of course Jeter is a first ballot HOFer....you're a moron if you think otherwise. He's going to finish his career with over 3,000 hits, 2,000 runs, 250 HRs, 300 SB and a career .313 hitter.

I don't understand how everyone is bashing his fielding...he's a fukking 5-time Gold Glove winner. He's never been accused of being on the juice, when in his prime was the IT thing to do. I hate the Yankees with a passion, but Jeter IS NOT a product of being on Yankees. He's the product of great preparation and having a God-given talent.

[VegasInsider]

Miguel Tejada was also highly believed to be using steroids while Jeter is highly believed to have always been clean. Big difference.

Boom! Discussion between Tejada vs. Jeter is OVER

[Sauz]

with out a doubt he is a 1st ballot hof

[C-Gold]

People in the know say Jeter took HGH.

Who cares if he's never been accused of taking roids. Everybody swore that A-Rod never took roids until he got caught and there were plenty of other guys that didn't LOOK like they took roids. Pujols looks like he did but he's never been accused. If somebody said this 235 pound Domican monster took roids would you be shocked? How many Domincans are big like Albert?

The point is his 5 gold gloves are a beauty contest joke. Nobody that knows anything about baseball would claim he's a good fielder. He doesn't make errors but that doesn't mean he's good at defense. Big difference. That's like saying we should put our sure handed Full back at WR because he has good hands. Jeter is a flat footed SS that can't even move anymore. It's pathetic.

[C-Gold]

Boom! Discussion between Tejada vs. Jeter is OVER

and I never even said Tejada had a better career, but look at all the hype attached to Jeter, and look at none of the hype dished out to a guy with a comperable career. It goes to show you just how astronomically overrated Derek Jeter really is.

[Buried_PIRATE]

Lol @ Tejada (known juicer... come on, be reals here kids his best #s cast SERIOUS doubt...)

Like I pointed out and was addressed by some other poster... look at Robin Yount on the Brewers (do you guys that think Jeter should not be in the HOF know who he is?)

For someone more contemporary look at Roberto Alomar. Jeter also > than him... and this is a guy that if he didnt spit on an umpire would have gotten 85% of the vote...

I also believe protection is over-rated. As a fan of the game, I would LOVE to see some definitive proof regarding players statistics and protection. Aside from being some generic "intangible."

My opinion is that Jeter just gets a bad rap cause the media loves him and they should be giving other players some more love. Haters gunna hate

[C-Gold]

Protection, playing on a stacked team, a hitters park and NYC is overrated?

Jeter swings at the first pitch WAYYYYYYY too much. He gets more fast balls because of the guys hitting behind him ( are better than him), and he gets to hit with more guys on base because he's been on a 200 million dollar team his entire career. When guys are on base pitchers have to throw more fast balls.

Jeter had a high average going for him, but he's an opposite field slap hitter. Not the kind of guy that scares pitchers. You throw a fastball down the middle and he slaps a single into right field... big whoop.

[Dukebluejms]

I know he has had a down last year and half, but this is a ridiculous question. He will definitely be in on his first ballot. The was one of the best all around players I've ever seen in his prime.

[Bob Loblaw]

and I never even said Tejada had a better career, but look at all the hype attached to Jeter, and look at none of the hype dished out to a guy with a comperable career. It goes to show you just how astronomically overrated Derek Jeter really is.

A. Jeter has been the better regular season player and clean anyway but...

B. So much of this game has to do with winning. Jeter is clutch and is one of, if not, the main reason his team won and competed in so many world series. Tejada on the other hand sucked ass in the postseason and was eliminated in the first round 4 years in a row. If roles were reversed and Jeter sucked as bad as Tejada in the postseason then he would get nothing but shit. Jeter may have gotten more praise than he deserved at some points but your boy Tejada didn't take on as much flack as he deserved at some points.

Tejada's posteseason numbers...

.212, 1 HR, 9R, 8RBI, 1SB, .242 OBP in 20 games

162 game pace that's about 8HR, 64RBI, 72R with a terrible BA and OBP

Hardly impressive

Tejada contributed largely to his teams being eliminated year after year. Jeter contributed largely to his teams advancing year after year.

[MartinBlank]

Protection, playing on a stacked team, a hitters park and NYC is overrated?

Jeter swings at the first pitch WAYYYYYYY too much. He gets more fast balls because of the guys hitting behind him ( are better than him), and he gets to hit with more guys on base because he's been on a 200 million dollar team his entire career. When guys are on base pitchers have to throw more fast balls.

Jeter had a high average going for him, but he's an opposite field slap hitter. Not the kind of guy that scares pitchers. You throw a fastball down the middle and he slaps a single into right field... big whoop.

Really?

Jeter has hit 234 Home Runs. How many shortstops have hit more?

Oh, and Jeter's 234 HR have come in 16 years.

Roberto Clemente hit 240 in 18 years of playing.

[Bob Loblaw]

A. Jeter has been the better regular season player and clean anyway but...

B. So much of this game has to do with winning. Jeter is clutch and is one of, if not, the main reason his team won and competed in so many world series. Tejada on the other hand sucked ass in the postseason and was eliminated in the first round 4 years in a row. If roles were reversed and Jeter sucked as bad as Tejada in the postseason then he would get nothing but shit. Jeter may have gotten more praise than he deserved at some points but your boy Tejada didn't take on as much flack as he deserved at some points.

Tejada's posteseason numbers...

.212, 1 HR, 9R, 8RBI, 1SB, .242 OBP in 20 games

162 game pace that's about 8HR, 64RBI, 72R with a terrible BA and OBP

Hardly impressive

Tejada contributed largely to his teams being eliminated year after year. Jeter contributed largely to his teams advancing year after year.

To expand further. In the A's four postseason appearances and quick elinations, 9 of their 12 losses came by 2 runs or less. Tejada who is supposed to be their guy had 2 rbi's or less in 3 of his 4 postseason appearances. He hit .130 or less in 2 of those postseasons and .260 or less in 3 of those postseasons. Those aren't the numbers of true winners like a Derek Jeter. The guy was garbage when it counted.

[nli07]

Jeter is a HALL FAMER and he will be voted in for his impact on the Yankees team. You can call it luck or whatever but he will be voted in. SImple as that.

[hostile takeover]

It's sad, but he probably will be first ballot because he was a yankee.

[dynamite140]

Everything C-Gold says in this thread is absolute the TRUTH


Jeter is the most overrated player in any sport. The only thing decent about Jeter is his batting average of .313. But besides that, he is the most overrated player in baseball. All his hits are SINGLES. I cannot believe some people say they rather have Jeter than Arod few years ago.

Really you want a guy on your team that averages


.313 16 HR 80 RBI per season

OR

.303 43 HR 129 RBI Per Season


And anyone that talk about that leadership crap is just talking BS. How is Jeter the leader of the team or captain? Him cheering in the dugout and saying lets go guys is making him a leader? Anyone on the team can do that.

[dynamite140]

Protection, playing on a stacked team, a hitters park and NYC is overrated?

Jeter swings at the first pitch WAYYYYYYY too much. He gets more fast balls because of the guys hitting behind him ( are better than him), and he gets to hit with more guys on base because he's been on a 200 million dollar team his entire career. When guys are on base pitchers have to throw more fast balls.

Jeter had a high average going for him, but he's an opposite field slap hitter. Not the kind of guy that scares pitchers. You throw a fastball down the middle and he slaps a single into right field... big whoop.

[beach nut]

Jeter has paid his dues.

[High3rEl3m3nt]

I think given the blemishes of the steroid era, what Jeter has accomplished within the history of the Yankees organization, and New York City's media's pull, he gets a first ballot nod easily. MLB has been trying desperately to salvage its reputation and become relevant again with fans and Jeter helps to achieve many of these goals. Personally, I think that they are doing an excellent job cracking down on performance enhancing drugs and it shows in the annual total home run numbers, which have drastically dropped since the issue came to light.

[jnickell100]

Of course he is a first ballot. He has played SS for the Yankees his entire career, that is a ton of pressure to be put upon. Look how many of the next "up and comer" dont pan out. He has played with a huge amount of pressure playing for the Yankees and has done a great job there.

[MartinBlank]

Everything C-Gold says in this thread is absolute the TRUTH


Jeter is the most overrated player in any sport. The only thing decent about Jeter is his batting average of .313. But besides that, he is the most overrated player in baseball. All his hits are SINGLES. I cannot believe some people say they rather have Jeter than Arod few years ago.

Really you want a guy on your team that averages


.313 16 HR 80 RBI per season

OR

.303 43 HR 129 RBI Per Season


And anyone that talk about that leadership crap is just talking BS. How is Jeter the leader of the team or captain? Him cheering in the dugout and saying lets go guys is making him a leader? Anyone on the team can do that.

So RBIs are the only factor that gets a guy into the HOF?

Honestly. Have you guys ever WATCHED baseball? Ever?

Jeter batted at the top of the Yankee order pretty much his entire career, how many RBI's are you expecting out of your leadoff hitter?

[markteal]

I'm a long way from being a Yankees fan, but yes, he's a legend. An asshole but still a legend

[MartinBlank]

I'm a long way from being a Yankees fan, but yes, he's a legend. An asshole but still a legend

That is how I feel about him. I can't even believe I am defending Jeter.

I really can't stand him. But the guy is a player and deserved to be in the HOF.

[C-Gold]

Really?

Jeter has hit 234 Home Runs. How many shortstops have hit more?

Oh, and Jeter's 234 HR have come in 16 years.

Roberto Clemente hit 240 in 18 years of playing.

You can't compare ERA's like that.

Babe Ruth hit 62 home runs when entire teams hit that many home runs. A 20 HR guy was a power hitter and the babe was hitting 40, 50, 60 HR's and he was also one of the top pitchers in the game. Babe Ruth hit some home runs early in his career where there was no fence. Imagine his fat ass running around the bases. Compare that to guys hitting 311 foot home runs of watered down pitching in a 32 or however many team league.

Jeter played his games in Yankee stadium ( hitter friendly), Camden Yards ( hitter friendly), Fenway ( hitter friendly) on a 200 million dollar team with some of the very best hitters ever behind him. Miguel Tejada was the guy... Jeter had one of the best players ever A-Rod behind him.

If you know you have a fastball coming it's so much easier... So what does Jeter do in the hitter friendly parks with the stacked lineup? Slap hitting singles. He had a good average, he was a good player for a long time in a hitting era, but he was never the best at his position. You credit him for longevity because he was good for a long time.

[MartinBlank]

You can't compare ERA's like that.

Babe Ruth hit 62 home runs when entire teams hit that many home runs. A 20 HR guy was a power hitter and the babe was hitting 40, 50, 60 HR's and he was also one of the top pitchers in the game. Babe Ruth hit some home runs early in his career where there was no fence. Imagine his fat ass running around the bases. Compare that to guys hitting 311 foot home runs of watered down pitching in a 32 or however many team league.

Jeter played his games in Yankee stadium ( hitter friendly), Camden Yards ( hitter friendly), Fenway ( hitter friendly) on a 200 million dollar team with some of the very best hitters ever behind him. Miguel Tejada was the guy... Jeter had one of the best players ever A-Rod behind him.

If you know you have a fastball coming it's so much easier... So what does Jeter do in the hitter friendly parks with the stacked lineup? Slap hitting singles. He had a good average, he was a good player for a long time in a hitting era, but he was never the best at his position. You credit him for longevity because he was good for a long time.

You keep running with that "theory" of yours Sparky no matter how goofy it is.

Rodriguez joined the Yankes in 2004. This may come as a shock to you, but Jeter started for 8 years as the Yankee SS before ARod joined the Yanks.

And without ARod, he finished in the Top 10 in hits in the majors from 1997-2003, his finished in the top 10 in BA 6 of his first 8 years, and another shock to you-----Jeter's offensive numbers in his first 8 years (without ARod) were in old Yankee Stadium----and as a RH Hitter---Yankee Stadium offered Jeter the same dimensions as Busch Memorial offered the Cards, or the Vet offered the Phillies, or Three Rivers offered the Pirates.

This is one of the dumbest debates ever on SBR. Jeter is a HOFer. He was before ARod joined the Yanks, and your insistance that it is because he played on a "200 million dollar" against bad teams, with short porches is beyond goofy. As I pointed out, if you are going to fault Jeter for playing on a talented club, then you may as well say the same thing about the three HOF Reds who played on the 75-76 Cincinnati teams, because they played on the greatest offensive team to ever play the game in a hitter friendly park (Riverfront).

[BRAVES1985]

yep

[gryfyn1]

You can't compare ERA's like that.

Babe Ruth hit 62 home runs when entire teams hit that many home runs. A 20 HR guy was a power hitter and the babe was hitting 40, 50, 60 HR's and he was also one of the top pitchers in the game. Babe Ruth hit some home runs early in his career where there was no fence. Imagine his fat ass running around the bases. Compare that to guys hitting 311 foot home runs of watered down pitching in a 32 or however many team league.

Jeter played his games in Yankee stadium ( hitter friendly), Camden Yards ( hitter friendly), Fenway ( hitter friendly) on a 200 million dollar team with some of the very best hitters ever behind him. Miguel Tejada was the guy... Jeter had one of the best players ever A-Rod behind him.

If you know you have a fastball coming it's so much easier... So what does Jeter do in the hitter friendly parks with the stacked lineup? Slap hitting singles. He had a good average, he was a good player for a long time in a hitting era, but he was never the best at his position. You credit him for longevity because he was good for a long time.

Sure but amung SS with 6500 PAs Jeter the "Slap hitter' ranks 8th in career SLG% and 5th in OPS.

or you could look at stats like wRC+ and wOBA which compares jeters stat to those in the league when he played.

Not surprisingly Jeter ranks 4th in wRC+ behind Wagner Arod and Vaughan, and his wOBA is 8th, of those in front of him only Vern Stevens not being in the HOF.

and Im not sure where you're getting this fact that Yankee stadium was some hitters paradise, because it wasn't. Unforunately the stats show it was about average over the length of Jeters career, and if anything it was more friendly to Lefties not righties.

[dynamite140]

So RBIs are the only factor that gets a guy into the HOF?

Honestly. Have you guys ever WATCHED baseball? Ever?

Jeter batted at the top of the Yankee order pretty much his entire career, how many RBI's are you expecting out of your leadoff hitter?

The only baseball games i watch are YANKEE GAMES and BRAVES games.


If you put Derek Jeter in the 3rd or 4th spot, you think that would make him get 120 RBI's a year?

He isn't nothing but a slap hitting singles hitter.

[marcoloco]

yep he will be

[tony_come]

HoF is overrated

yes jeter will be a HoFer one day

currently he should be batting 7 or 8 not leadoff

[thebestthereis]

aside from jeter playing in ny and winning multiple titles with clutch hit after clutch hit, 3000 hits you are in the hall of fame period. unless you knowingly gamble on baseball and or cheat by taking roids. dumb question.

[Bob Loblaw]

The only baseball games i watch are YANKEE GAMES and BRAVES games.


If you put Derek Jeter in the 3rd or 4th spot, you think that would make him get 120 RBI's a year?

He isn't nothing but a slap hitting singles hitter.

You don't have to be a power hitter to be a great player. Ichiro's the same way. He's a singles hitter and lots of them are of the slap variety. In no way is Ichiro overrated. Jeter's job isn't to drive in 120 runs. Jeter has a different job for his spot in the order and he's done it exceptionally well for many years.

[C-Gold]

You don't have to be a power hitter to be a great player. Ichiro's the same way. He's a singles hitter and lots of them are of the slap variety. In no way is Ichiro overrated. Jeter's job isn't to drive in 120 runs. Jeter has a different job for his spot in the order and he's done it exceptionally well for many years.

Ichiro is a much better player, and if he had played in the United States he would have had much better stats than Jeter over the course of his career but played in quiet Seattle.

FYI, I never said Jeter won't make the HOF because he will. My argument is that he's the most overrated player in any sport at any time. It's not even close. He got a lot of career hits because he's been on the best offensive team of the last 17 years and got more at bats. The people that voted him Gold Gloves are like the people that voted Grant Hill to the NBA all star game when he was injured, or Cal Ripken to the MLB All star game when he was hitting .230. He got there by name and by being in a big city. Jeter was a good player over the course of his career that found himself in the perfect circumstances.

[MartinBlank]

Ichiro is a much better player, and if he had played in the United States he would have had much better stats than Jeter over the course of his career but played in quiet Seattle.

FYI, I never said Jeter won't make the HOF because he will. My argument is that he's the most overrated player in any sport at any time. It's not even close. He got a lot of career hits because he's been on the best offensive team of the last 17 years and got more at bats. The people that voted him Gold Gloves are like the people that voted Grant Hill to the NBA all star game when he was injured, or Cal Ripken to the MLB All star game when he was hitting .230. He got there by name and by being in a big city. Jeter was a good player over the course of his career that found himself in the perfect circumstances.

So Jeter getting 3000 hits was easy because ARod batted behind him for 6 years?

I have a question.

If it is so easy, why aren't there more players appoaching 3000 hits?

This one isn't hard to figure out. You hate Jeter, and you aren't about to give him any respect because in your mind he only managed 3000 g'damn hits because all anyone ever threw Jeter was a fastball.

Oh by the way. Nice dodge from your earlier assetion that the old Yankee Stadium was short for Right Handed Hitters. Keep hatin on Jeter, don't give in. Ever.

[C-Gold]

Jeter has been playing for 17 freaking years and has stayed healthy. He hit at the front of the best lineup in baseball for 17 years. If you plugged Ichiro Suzuki into the #1 or #2 slot of the best lineup in baseball for 17 years and gave him 600, 650 or 700 at bats every season do you think he'd have 3,000 hits?

Jeter is a good average hitter no doubt but he didn't deserve 1/10th the media attention he got. He wasn't ever anywhere near the best player in baseball... ever and he wasn't ever even the best player at his position. His body of work and career stats are what happens when you put a good player in the best lineup for 17 years. Hall of fame? Yes. Good player on the best team? Yes. Best player on the best team? No. He got a lot more than his fair share of hype.