[C-Gold]

Whenever you watch ESPN 90% of the time all of the commentary is positive, " Johnny is going to be a GREAT player, he still has to work on X but I think he's going to be a good pro". Rarely do you have people call out top picks unless they have obvious flaws... Tim Tebow, Darren Mcfadden, Reggie Bush etc.

Kurt Warner is not a believer in Cam Newton and neither am I. He's Vince Young without the odd delivery at best. He was basically a 1 year wonder in college. Took snaps from the shotgun and not a pro style offense like other top prospects. Relied too much on his legs and didn't develop enough as a passer. Was used to being physically bigger than his opponents but he'll be average in the NFL, has shit for brains, is immature, cocky. Just look at what he said when he got drafted ( I want to celebrate) and contrast that with guys like Matt Ryan ( I'm ready to work).

The best guy to compare Cam Newton to is Vince Young but Young was a better prospect
Both big/athletic quarterbacks that were known for their legs/size/winning in college
Young's rose bowl shot his stock up higher ( than it should be) same with Cam Newton
Vince Young was a 3 year starter, Cam is a 1 year starter * this is a biggie
Vince was decent at the dink/dunk passing game, Cam is a weaker passer
Neither are really intelligent but Vince Young's football smarts are underrated and better than Cam's
Both have mental flaws ( Vince Young suicide/Cam Newton's extreme Ryan Leaf like immaturity/cocky)

Vince Young is probably the upside for Cam Newton, but Vince Young was a better prospect than Cam Newton. Vince was a 3 year starter, had more football smarts but had the odd throwing delivery that hasn't been a huge huge problem for him.

But Kurt Warner said why would you pick a guy like this? Have any scramblers even won a super bowl? NO. The best players in the NFL are the POCKET PASSERS!!!! TOM BRADY, PEYTON MANNING, DREW BREES, AARON RODGERS. Who'se winning the rings? Jim Mora said he'd rather have Jake Lockier than Cam Newton. This goes for the black scrambling quarterbacks and the white ones as well but scramblers are usually associated with black quarterbacks.

These scramblers are beauty contest winners come draft time. People fall so irrationally in love with a scrambler's legs just like they fall in love with a guy with a strong arm. Neither are the most important factors to success. You need a guy that's (smart and works hard). Physical skills are secondary to mental skills and preparation. Cam Newton saying he wants to celebrate is a big mistake in itself.

[Scorpion]

i have beens saying this for the last 20 years:
POCKET PASSERS WIN CHAMPIONSHIPS!!!

[CaptainPrice]

hes not calling out black qbs
I agree with him

[Johnnythunder]

Good for Warner

[GunShard]

Maybe Jake Locker should have been the #1 draft pick.

[C-Gold]

i have beens saying this for the last 20 years:
POCKET PASSERS WIN CHAMPIONSHIPS!!!

So have I, and all I hear in the media is how yes... Peyton Manning, Tom Brady etc. are the BEST QB's in the game, but Michael Vick, Vince Young etc. are the most "exciting", "dynamic" blah blah blah. About 7 years ago a lot of these guys were getting drafted and some people were saying the Peyton Mannings ( immoble) guys of the world were going to be extinct.

Peyton Manning's Brain is a lot more dangers than Michael Vick's legs. You can run Vick down and corner him but you can't cover every inch of the field and react to where receivers with good timing with their quarterback are going.

[zoso11871]

i have beens saying this for the last 20 years:
POCKET PASSERS WIN CHAMPIONSHIPS!!!

Agreed

[uhuhahah]

I don' like running QB....

[agharah1]

There's a difference between a mobile QB and a running QB. None of this year's qbs were any good. Gabbert doesn't have deep ball accuracy. Mallett has all the poise of Ryan Leaf. Locker has no accuracy at all (although playing on a severely talent depleted team might have been a factor). And Cam Newton isn't really a QB.

[redrum]

looker is a mobile qb in the same mold as vince young without the nc and he bthrows better than vince young. vick is the man. he will win a bbowl in philly before its done

[Frostware]

ohh a white guy pulled the black card... black guys always pull the white card... bout time.

[killawookie]

Proud to be a fan....

[C-Gold]

Warner didn't actually say Black QB, but he said running QB's ( Cam Newton, Vince Young etc.) don't win. Cam Newton's career will be marked by injuries, cool runs, and a lot of interceptions and failures.

Sportscenter loves when these runners make amazing plays and they air them over and over again but they don't show you all of those wide open receivers they missed over and over and over again.

Mobile quarterbacks are a mirage.

[redrum]

you pick players to fill ur seats an give ur team a buzz. which qb in the draft this yr and last was the most talk about. th both were mobile tebow and cam

[CaptainPrice]

looker is a mobile qb in the same mold as vince young without the nc and he bthrows better than vince young. vick is the man. he will win a bbowl in philly before its done

a bbowl??
the the heck is that

[samdapatriotsfan]

This is Warner's opinion and just because it has not happened yet does not mean it will not happen in the future.

Hopefully in his lifetime I get to see his sorry ass face when a 'running QB' wins the SB. I bet there won't be any admission of being wrong but he will be sucking on some toe jam.

[Preston09]

This has been said and proven for so long now but it will one day change.

[Dax]

Running QB's give a different perspective to all defenses which are used to playing against the Pocket QB's and this usually causes them problems and can hardly stop these types of offenses. Times are changing and the fashion the game is being played is also changing, a QB that can move outside of the pocket gives a small advantage to his team; the only issue with this is that it leaves him open to injuries which in the long run affects the whole team, It's risky but again it gives you an advantage over the vast majority of defenses in the league. I do think that it doesn't matter if you are a pocket QB or a running QB as long as you have a High football IQ you'll be able to read the defense and be able to get rid of the ball when you have to or run when you can which will make you a great player, (this is what Vick is lacking, he's got good legs and an OK arm, but can't make those split second decisions, he tends to fold under pressure)
NOW with that being said I would like to clarify that I too agree that Newton is just not going to be the player everyone thinks he'll be he is overrated and I think the Panthers could have made a better choice in the draft. but that's just me.

[McBa1n]

I think you have to be cautious here. Aaron Rodgers is very much capable of 'scrambling' to keep the play alive and does it amongst the top rushing QBs. He's excellent from the pocket, though, and reads defenses with the best of them. I think you're missing the point on mobility. If a player sees nothing and the pocket is collapsing, then you do what? Get sacked 50 times? No, you run for your life and try to keep the play alive. Mobile QBs get drafted where they do because the teams usually stink and have no offensive line, nor anything other than 'servicable' receivers, for the most part. However, the bad thing is, so many mobile QBs have been rushed into service. I think Vince Young could've spent more time from the bench and developed. I still think the guy is a winner and can play in the NFL.

Lots of non-mobile QBs bust out, also. Highly accurate lower arm strength guys. OR guys with cannons and no accuracy. To single out mobile QBs or "black" QBs (to appease you racist fahks) as the only QBs capable of 'busting' is utter crap. WAY more QBs bust and none are known for their mobility - yet no one goes crazy over them. It's an unfair standard. For every Jamarcus Russel, there's a Matt Leinart, a Kyle Boller, a Dave Ragone and on and on and on. But for SOME reason, rolling the dice on a mobile QB with a big arm is a 'risk' and they are why all mobile QBs are busts. Donovan McNabb came out as a mobile QB and went to the Superbowl and a DICKLOAD of championship games. Mike Vick has taken his teams to the playoffs, also. Aaron Rodgers was running for his life for 2 seasons and heck, won a Superbowl. He's not black, but he scrambled a LOT and has a dickload of rushing yards to prove it.

If you want to do the math, percentage wise, ALL QBs bust out, regardless of style at about the same clip. You knuckleheads are looking at the QB position through a b.s. lens. It doesn't matter, though, none of us run NFL teams. All that matters is winning punts on Sundays. I'm sure you all bet with your racism *rolls eyes*. That's pathetic. If 'black QBs' are so horrible, then I hope in saying as such, you don't ever bet on them ever. Of course that's not the case, but a knucklehead has to have something to complain about.

[cant call it]

I would have taken ryan mallett before I took cam newton. Neither is a #1 picks IMO

[thebestthereis]

nobody is a #1 pick just get to round 3 or 4 and start there

[jollyoscars]

couldnt agree more. no doubt in my mind jake locker becomes the best qb out of this class!

[knelson]

I've thought that this QB class has been overrated from the start due to QB needs among teams.

[McBa1n]

It's really hard to know what will happen with all the QBs taken. Certainly, Cam Newton has the highest 'ceiling'. I wouldn't have taken him, though. Out of spending dickloads of hours studying QBs, Dalton, Locker and Mallet were the only 'true' #1st round QBs. All 3 have tape on them from the pocket, although Dalton and Locker ran more than I'd like (Locker way way too much). If I had my choice, I'd have to flip a coin on Locker and Dalton. Heck, leaving Mallet out of the conversation makes me question that. I think all 3 can step in day 1 and start their development, of course, the longer they sit, the better, though. Newton, for certain, needs to sit for at least 2 years, but there's almost no way that's going to happen.

It's a tough call with this draft class, but the QB who doesn't get mentioned that made me go 'who is this guy?' is Tyrod Taylor. I've seen enough tape on him to spend a mid-round draft pick on him and let him sit and develop. The kid can ball, for sure. Probably the least sung QB in the draft.

All that b.s. said, the guy I really would've wanted is Locker, but that was before I spent a LOT of time on Dalton. Wow. I havn't seen a kid come out throwing such good balls in a long time. I think Locker has a higher upside, but sheesh - I could watch Dalton sling it all day. Cinci had a fantastic prospective draft, for certain.

BTW, I want everyone on here that's 'tough' and intelligent about 'black' QBs to sit back and watch all the 'white' QBs from this draft bust, also. Remember, Christian Ponder was taken 12th and Gabbert 10th. You just don't draft those guys at those draft positions unless you want them starting NOW. I hope you hold them to the same standard... But I about figure it's about time for another Cam Newton 'black QBs' suck thread.

[Qtip]

Call me racist, don't really care, it's too much of a correlation.

How many black QB's have won a Superbowl? Doug Williams? I think it's 1.
How many Superbowl champion teams had a starting white running back (Past 20 years)? 0.5? Alstott, if he counts.

You don't take a black QB first round and you don't take a white running back in the first 2 rounds of any draft ever or you're an idiot. Let alone #1.

Obviously, one day, one of these picks will pan out. But I don't think I have to explain why should play the odds(math) when it's in your favor on a gambling forum.

[icancount2one]

Aaron Rodgers had the 2nd most rushing yards last year.

Brainless Big Ben has a couple of rings, mostly because of his awesome defense, but his physical characteristics are a big part of his game.

Vick took a team that a LOT of people on this forum thought was going nowhere to the playoffs, and Young has a great regular season record but TEN always seems to get bounced from the playoffs on some total BS. I find Young's modest success more impressive based on the fact that his coach constantly undermines him.

As others have noted, superbowls may very well be on the way for Vick if he can stay healthy for an entire season. Philly has twice as much talent as any Falcons team Vick was on and they're still young and getting better.

[Scottish]

Good, its true!

[Dex17]

Whenever you watch ESPN 90% of the time all of the commentary is positive, " Johnny is going to be a GREAT player, he still has to work on X but I think he's going to be a good pro". Rarely do you have people call out top picks unless they have obvious flaws... Tim Tebow, Darren Mcfadden, Reggie Bush etc.

Kurt Warner is not a believer in Cam Newton and neither am I. He's Vince Young without the odd delivery at best. He was basically a 1 year wonder in college. Took snaps from the shotgun and not a pro style offense like other top prospects. Relied too much on his legs and didn't develop enough as a passer. Was used to being physically bigger than his opponents but he'll be average in the NFL, has shit for brains, is immature, cocky. Just look at what he said when he got drafted ( I want to celebrate) and contrast that with guys like Matt Ryan ( I'm ready to work).

The best guy to compare Cam Newton to is Vince Young but Young was a better prospect
Both big/athletic quarterbacks that were known for their legs/size/winning in college
Young's rose bowl shot his stock up higher ( than it should be) same with Cam Newton
Vince Young was a 3 year starter, Cam is a 1 year starter * this is a biggie
Vince was decent at the dink/dunk passing game, Cam is a weaker passer
Neither are really intelligent but Vince Young's football smarts are underrated and better than Cam's
Both have mental flaws ( Vince Young suicide/Cam Newton's extreme Ryan Leaf like immaturity/cocky)

Vince Young is probably the upside for Cam Newton, but Vince Young was a better prospect than Cam Newton. Vince was a 3 year starter, had more football smarts but had the odd throwing delivery that hasn't been a huge huge problem for him.

But Kurt Warner said why would you pick a guy like this? Have any scramblers even won a super bowl? NO. The best players in the NFL are the POCKET PASSERS!!!! TOM BRADY, PEYTON MANNING, DREW BREES, AARON RODGERS. Who'se winning the rings? Jim Mora said he'd rather have Jake Lockier than Cam Newton. This goes for the black scrambling quarterbacks and the white ones as well but scramblers are usually associated with black quarterbacks.

These scramblers are beauty contest winners come draft time. People fall so irrationally in love with a scrambler's legs just like they fall in love with a guy with a strong arm. Neither are the most important factors to success. You need a guy that's (smart and works hard). Physical skills are secondary to mental skills and preparation. Cam Newton saying he wants to celebrate is a big mistake in itself.

It's pretty idiotic to interpret Warner's remarks as a race thing. C'mon man!

Steve Young was actually a good running QB. Aaron Rodgers is one of the best scrambling QBs in the game. Mike Vick became a solid QB when he learned to be a pocket-passer and use his legs to make plays, just like Roethlisberger. It's not a race thing. It's just a simple-minded way to view quarterback skill-sets.

[Dex17]

BTW, Cam Newton is an idiot. He'll never be a dominant QB because of that. His great athleticism is the only reason why he'll get a shot, just like Vince Young, who is another moron. They're not stupid b/c they're black; they're stupid b/c they're stupid, as proven by tests, interviews, and off the field activities.

[Dax]

You got a point there, and race absolutely has nothing to do with it.

[McBa1n]

Call me racist, don't really care, it's too much of a correlation.

How many black QB's have won a Superbowl? Doug Williams? I think it's 1.
How many Superbowl champion teams had a starting white running back (Past 20 years)? 0.5? Alstott, if he counts.

You don't take a black QB first round and you don't take a white running back in the first 2 rounds of any draft ever or you're an idiot. Let alone #1.

Obviously, one day, one of these picks will pan out. But I don't think I have to explain why should play the odds(math) when it's in your favor on a gambling forum.

Yes, you are horribly racist, sorry.
You're holding black QBs to a standard of which WHITES bust out almost 10 to 1 (if not a DICKLOAD higher).
You also have to understand that history dictates why black people are getting opportunities around the NFL (Rooney rule). Mostly white people decide things in the NFL, whilst the black man is held to a higher and almost impossible standard to live up to. No one talks about a 'top 3' in Green Bay's staff, that were all black under Favre, because no one spends the time to understand that race means a toss in the NFL.

You see, a guy that wins games almost 2 to 1 (Vince Young) is a free agent, you see the incurrent racism in the NFL. The VAST majority of players in the NFL are black, and to me? Who gives a toss.
I would take Jimmy Taylor #1, if he was in college. That's one white boy RB that had a HOF career.
I'm just saying - race has 0 to do with ANYTHING. A god damn good player is a god damn good player.

If you're bringing race into the conversation, you don't know football and I would LOVE for you to submit your picks every week to me. I'm not saying black QBs are better than whites. I'm just saying - if you think all black QBs stink and you have 0 idea of American history, then let me know your picks. If you take a black QB, then your argument is SHITE and you should probably be incinerated because you're not understanding that color does NOT dictate ability level. Ability level dictates that - but we're in a nation that cannot get over that the south got their asses whooped and slavery is illegal. A man is a man is a man, it's in the US Constitution FFS.

Who gives a shite over color? If you are, then you probably need your head checked. F racist mentality. Your shite stinks, also. You will also die. OMG, just like EVERY human on the planet. Sorry, go F yourselves, racist wankers. I wish I knew why people believed some races were better than some others.

[andywend]

McBain, the only racist posting in this thread is YOU.

YOU are the one who constantly brings up the race card in every post you write.

I wish I knew why people believed some races were better than some others.

Not only are you incredibly racist, but you're extremely STUPID as well.

If you're talking about basketball, blacks are far better than whites which is why over 90% of the NBA consists of black players. When talking about football quarterbacks, whites excel over blacks because in order to be a truly successful NFL QB, you have to have a high level of intelligence.

If you're bringing race into the conversation, you don't know football and I would LOVE for you to submit your picks every week to me. I'm not saying black QBs are better than whites. I'm just saying - if you think all black QBs stink and you have 0 idea of American history, then let me know your picks. If you take a black QB, then your argument is SHITE and you should probably be incinerated because you're not understanding that color does NOT dictate ability level. Ability level dictates that - but we're in a nation that cannot get over that the south got their asses whooped and slavery is illegal. A man is a man is a man, it's in the US Constitution FFS.

The plain simple truth which has been proven over and over again is that blacks are far more athletic than whites and whites are far more intelligent than blacks. If politically correct liberals like yourself had their way, every single NFL team would finish 8-8 and receive participation trophies.

You're bringing up the constitution and "a man is a man" to try and defend your position that all races are equal when it comes to ability level in sports. Are you really that stupid?

[darrell74]

Racist people are funnier and more fun
they have funnier jokes

Anti-racist people are too uptight
don't know how to relax and not be so judgmental

[Lincoln73]

a quarterbacks success isn't based on whether they scramble or not it is based on accuracy of throws, which is why Locker will never be an elite nfl qb.

[Badgers13]

Warner know what hes talking about