[Coach Jake]

I am just curious what ya'll do in this situation. I'm not exactly a high roller, but I've made it to a point where I'm no longer just betting and losing for fun. Regardless, i see alot of players here who make real high wagers, and I'm wondering what we do come tax time.

Technically, you should file as gambling earnings and pay the 30% short term gains tax. However, it's easy to fly under the radar on some of these payments, but once your bank receives around $10,000 total from a single source, then they have to file documents to the IRS. So it seems to me under $10,000 ok, but over not ok? I have a little while until I hit that margin, but it's crazy to think filing 30% on short term means that instead of paying -110 on juice, we're actually supposed to be paying -140.

[esulima]

find someone to cash it for u and let them worry about it

[RavensFan2k3]

I never thought about that. Is this what all banks do, whether it is savings or checkings? If you cash it, and deposit it through cash, does it make a difference?

[Coach Jake]

Cash is untraceable, so I think you have the right idea. Maybe It's smart to cash the check somewhere else and then deposit as cash into my checking like you said. I think then the problem will still remain, but it'd be between where I'm getting cashed and the IRS, so either way I should be ok as long as I don't cash more than $10,000 at one place? Any info is appreciated....but I think we just need the shawshank redemption guy

[Coach Jake]

and also, BetOnline pays through one of the us bank branches(wells fargo?) that also might have to declare after a certain amount?

[Murray Rothbard]

I used to work at a credit union and I am pretty sure it is standard across the board (credit unions and banks) that any cash deposits or withdrawals in the sum of 10,000.01+ have to be reported to the IRS.

EDIT: I don't remember clearly, but I don't recall having to fill out a report for check deposits larger or electronic transfers over 10K. Hope this info helps.

[Murray Rothbard]

I have a legal question for you guys. I am under the impression that since there are all types of books out there who advertise, is it legal for us to bet on these sites? I know it's not legal for these sites to provide the services they do on American soil (hence why they are all based outside the country) but as a player is it legal to gamble on these sites?

I ask because I opened in account at 5 Dimes but I'm worried about funding the account since I'm not certain about the legality of it all. Any help would be much appreciated.

[Coach Jake]

so is it only if I deposit $10,000 at once, or would it also include 4 $2,500 payments within one year?

For your answer it's not explicitly illegal, and any charge would be questionable and not very severe, and their servers are based outside the US s I don't think they're as volnurable to a US asset freeze. The bigger concern is the IRS who would want you to pay that 30%, especially if you are a high roller. The Same goes for other trading markets like stocks, etc.

[Coach Jake]

I recommend you fund a little bit, but dn't start with much if you're new to the grind. Lost my first deposit 2 yrs ago, and now I learned how t make a buck, but Im still suprised.

[RG3ING]

I have a guy that sells me his losing gambling receipt from slots high roller.. U can only use losing gambling to equal out ur winning gambling an normally high rollers have them cause they know they can sell them at minimum cause it saves u a ton of tax money do its a win win for both

[Mac4Lyfe]

Some banks will report deposits in excess of $3,000 as well. So it's not limited to $10,000. In fact a bank can report deposit of any amount. Also, be very careful of wire transfers that you endorse with your nam . I know a guy that went to jail for cashing transfers. He couldn't prove how he earned the money and the feds got him for money laundering.


http://forfeiturereform.com/2012/03/...in-a-bank-too/

However, any attempt (involving any amount of money) to avoid the filing of any required financial report can lead to the forfeiture of an individual’s property. Transactions for more than $3,000 are identified and tracked by an individual’s name and identifying numbers. Making deposits between $3,000 and $10,000 is an ineffectual method to launder, or hide, funds. Transactions for less than $3,000 are scrutinized for patterns of structuring deposits to avoid the $3,000 identification threshold, as well.

[RG3ING]

It's simple just provide losing gambling receipts to balance it out it's 100% legal an legit!!!!!!!!!

[RavensFan2k3]

Also when you say $10,000 from a single source...are you talking about in one transaction, or total over a course of multiple transactions?

[Bigh2001]

There's no federal law prohibiting individual online gambling that I'm aware of. The 2007 stuff went after payment processors and made it illegal to facilitate transactions at gambling sites. Whether it is "illegal" is a matter of state laws prohibiting gambling. I don't know that there are many states who have gambling laws to cover online betting.

I have a legal question for you guys. I am under the impression that since there are all types of books out there who advertise, is it legal for us to bet on these sites? I know it's not legal for these sites to provide the services they do on American soil (hence why they are all based outside the country) but as a player is it legal to gamble on these sites?

I ask because I opened in account at 5 Dimes but I'm worried about funding the account since I'm not certain about the legality of it all. Any help would be much appreciated.

[R.P. McMurphy]

Thats whats great about locals ... cash only baby! And fukk the theiving banks just bury it in your fukkin closet like Pesci in Casino lol!!

[Coach Jake]

It's simple just provide losing gambling receipts to balance it out it's 100% legal an legit!!!!!!!!!

How and where would I get losing receipts? And wouldn't the people with the losing receipts want to keep them to declare as losses?

So it seems keep withdrawals under $3000. Still never figured out if it's good or bad to cash a TOTAL of $10,000 or more over a year.

[Murray Rothbard]

How and where would I get losing receipts? And wouldn't the people with the losing receipts want to keep them to declare as losses?

So it seems keep withdrawals under $3000. Still never figured out if it's good or bad to cash a TOTAL of $10,000 or more over a year.

Just keep in mind Jake, that if you just keep w/ding say 2,500 and this isn't something you've already made a habit of doing the bank will flag you for taking part in "suspicious activity."

[Murray Rothbard]

There's no federal law prohibiting individual online gambling that I'm aware of. The 2007 stuff went after payment processors and made it illegal to facilitate transactions at gambling sites. Whether it is "illegal" is a matter of state laws prohibiting gambling. I don't know that there are many states who have gambling laws to cover online betting.

Thanks for the answer Bigh!

[possum11]

if your book is good they will send checks from different company names in different U.S. states, so they won't be from the same source.

[Mac4Lyfe]

Players have little to fear. There is no federal law against playing online. U.S. Attorney Catherine Hanaway admitted in a 2007 House hearing that just placing wagers online isn't against federal law. Players might run afoul of state laws, but even that is rare. The one case we know of is Jeffrey Trauman, of North Dakota, who paid a $500 fine on what was probably over $100,000 in sports bet winnings. (Gambling & the Law)
Small publishers taking ads have little to fear.
The only publishers to face penalties were some huge publishers (Google, Yahoo, and Microsoft, in 2007), and a mid-size publisher in 2006 (The Sporting News). Each simply paid a fine, and faced no criminal charges. The Sporting News' fine was equal to the money they'd collected from gambling ads. Google's penalty was only about a third of a single day's profit for them. (Point-Spreads.com)
Other publishers who took ads (like Esquire, who ran Bodog's poker ads) were warned by the DoJ not to take them any more, stopped doing so, and faced no penalties.
Smaller publishers have never been warned by the feds to stop taking online gambling ads, so far as we know.
Advertisers who promote their sportsbooks in traditional media (magazines, billboards) can face scrutiny as operators. But sportsbooks have never been scrutinized for advertising online. Also, online casinos, poker rooms, and affiliates (vs. sportsbooks) have never faced heat for the act of buying ads, in any medium.
Operators have had no trouble as long as they're based outside the U.S., stay outside the U.S. and deal only with casino / poker wagers. Offshore sportsbooks might face action if they're blatant (advertising on billboards), and/or take bets over the phone.
That's the summary.

[RavensFan2k3]

Just keep in mind Jake, that if you just keep w/ding say 2,500 and this isn't something you've already made a habit of doing the bank will flag you for taking part in "suspicious activity."

My thing is why does the bank automatically assume suspicious activity? Why couldnt I have gotten a new job, especially if Im making consistant deposits? How do people ever get large payouts without getting flagged n what not?

[Murray Rothbard]

My thing is why does the bank automatically assume suspicious activity? Why couldnt I have gotten a new job, especially if Im making consistant deposits? How do people ever get large payouts without getting flagged n what not?

IMO, the banks could care less, they are still going to make money regardless. The issue is with the government and the crazy amount of regulations they force banks to follow. With the advent of 9/11 and now the GFC of 2008 (great financial crises) banks have to report all sorts of activity to the government and it is my opinion that if someone starts to seemingly, out of the blue, get large deposits in their accounts and then they are w/ding those large deposits a red flag will be raised somewhere and the bank will file a SARs or suspicious activity report.

I've been out of the banking industry for over a year now and to be honest I don't remember a lot with respect to regulations and the like but I remember having compliance meetings in where this type of stuff got discuss and it was emphasized that we should be on the look out for people structuring transactions and w/ding large sums of cash when that wasn't normally the case.

[RavensFan2k3]

IMO, the banks could care less, they are still going to make money regardless. The issue is with the government and the crazy amount of regulations they force banks to follow. With the advent of 9/11 and now the GFC of 2008 (great financial crises) banks have to report all sorts of activity to the government and it is my opinion that if someone starts to seemingly, out of the blue, get large deposits in their accounts and then they are w/ding those large deposits a red flag will be raised somewhere and the bank will file a SARs or suspicious activity report.

I've been out of the banking industry for over a year now and to be honest I don't remember a lot with respect to regulations and the like but I remember having compliance meetings in where this type of stuff got discuss and it was emphasized that we should be on the look out for people structuring transactions and w/ding large sums of cash when that wasn't normally the case.

So would it only cause a concern if one were to be depositing a few thousand at a time and then withdrawing most or all of it immediately?

[Huego]

there's so much misinformation in this thread... it's hilarious.

[Murray Rothbard]

Players have little to fear. There is no federal law against playing online. U.S. Attorney Catherine Hanaway admitted in a 2007 House hearing that just placing wagers online isn't against federal law. Players might run afoul of state laws, but even that is rare. The one case we know of is Jeffrey Trauman, of North Dakota, who paid a $500 fine on what was probably over $100,000 in sports bet winnings. (Gambling & the Law)
Small publishers taking ads have little to fear.
The only publishers to face penalties were some huge publishers (Google, Yahoo, and Microsoft, in 2007), and a mid-size publisher in 2006 (The Sporting News). Each simply paid a fine, and faced no criminal charges. The Sporting News' fine was equal to the money they'd collected from gambling ads. Google's penalty was only about a third of a single day's profit for them. (Point-Spreads.com)
Other publishers who took ads (like Esquire, who ran Bodog's poker ads) were warned by the DoJ not to take them any more, stopped doing so, and faced no penalties.
Smaller publishers have never been warned by the feds to stop taking online gambling ads, so far as we know.
Advertisers who promote their sportsbooks in traditional media (magazines, billboards) can face scrutiny as operators. But sportsbooks have never been scrutinized for advertising online. Also, online casinos, poker rooms, and affiliates (vs. sportsbooks) have never faced heat for the act of buying ads, in any medium.
Operators have had no trouble as long as they're based outside the U.S., stay outside the U.S. and deal only with casino / poker wagers. Offshore sportsbooks might face action if they're blatant (advertising on billboards), and/or take bets over the phone.
That's the summary.

I missed this initially but thanks a lot for this. By any chance are you a lawyer?

[Murray Rothbard]

So would it only cause a concern if one were to be depositing a few thousand at a time and then withdrawing most or all of it immediately?

If this was done once or just every once in a good while I would say no. If this was being down once a week or 3 or 4 times a month it may be. It really all depends on the institution and whether or not this activity is common on behalf of the individual.

What I would recommend is for people to open up an account at a small local credit union and start doing those types of transactions from the get go. Usually small credit unions aren't held to such tight standards as are most of the major financial institutions and so it wouldn't look as suspicious. Plus smaller credit unions are more customer oriented so as long as you come up with some legitimate excuse as to why you are getting large deposits and then w/ding they may not even care.

I just want to stress that these are my opinions and by no means am I an expert on this stuff. I just know from personal experience working at a credit union that the biggest thing they look for are people who seem like they are structuring transactions to avoid having to file them to the IRS as well as people getting random large deposits and then w/ding them immediately. I also know from personal experience that employees at credit unions/banks hate to file these IRS reports because they are time consuming so as long as you keep your transactions 5K or below I don't think you'll have too much trouble.

[falconticket]

Better to just report it and pay. Government needs your help. They can put it to good use

[Murray Rothbard]

Better to just report it and pay. Government needs your help. They can put it to good use

Good one.

[nj1035]

1.) You have to pay taxes on gambling winnings, but only on the portion that is ABOVE your gambling losses. Hence, if you win $10,000 in bets, and lose $8,000 in bets, you pay tax on $2,000.

2.) If you lose money on the year, that is not tax deductible. So you cannot use your net gambling losses to offset any other income.

3.) I believe gambling winnings would be a short-term gains tax. However, from what I understand you only pay the tax rate that your current income provides for. So if you normally sit at 17% (or whatever it is for your normal income), you would be taxed at 17%. I could be wrong on this but I think that's how it works.

[RavensFan2k3]

If this was done once or just every once in a good while I would say no. If this was being down once a week or 3 or 4 times a month it may be. It really all depends on the institution and whether or not this activity is common on behalf of the individual.

What I would recommend is for people to open up an account at a small local credit union and start doing those types of transactions from the get go. Usually small credit unions aren't held to such tight standards as are most of the major financial institutions and so it wouldn't look as suspicious. Plus smaller credit unions are more customer oriented so as long as you come up with some legitimate excuse as to why you are getting large deposits and then w/ding they may not even care.

I just want to stress that these are my opinions and by no means am I an expert on this stuff. I just know from personal experience working at a credit union that the biggest thing they look for are people who seem like they are structuring transactions to avoid having to file them to the IRS as well as people getting random large deposits and then w/ding them immediately. I also know from personal experience that employees at credit unions/banks hate to file these IRS reports because they are time consuming so as long as you keep your transactions 5K or below I don't think you'll have too much trouble.

I see what you are saying. Thanks for the insight man. My thing is, what if I'm not withdrawing them? What if I'm making deposits, and just depositing them, whether its into a checking account or a savings account? Why would anyone deposit a large sum and withdraw it all immediately? Who does that? If you wanted it in cash, why not go into a check cashing store?

[El Sol]

I've been doing this this for more than twenty years. Here's what I do.



If you want to be legit and pay taxes, but are having trouble deducting your loses without proof, the local race track is the easiest and most common way to go. Grab a racing form and a program from the trash, save them and claim them. Then go to the luxury suite and pick up losing tickets from the floor. On a good day, you can pick up $10,000 in just a few losing tickets, make sure you have a matching racing program to go along with it. This is very common and tracks are all over the country and are respected.

Use multiple domestic bank accounts. Use Off shore accounts if you are a high roller. Off shore accounts can be risky if you're not hooked up with the right people.

Cash your checks and If you want to invest and save the cash, buy gold and silver coins and store them in a safe deposit box. Coins are great because there are multiple ways to claim them. Like family heirlooms or 'finding' them in a public storage locker you bought in an auction. I buy coins,and my plans are to pass these down to my kid(s) avoiding multiple layers of taxes.

[BigDofBA]

LOL. No one on this site wins enough to even have to worry about it.

[Pivotpoint]

I've been doing this this for more than twenty years. Here's what I do.



If you want to be legit and pay taxes, but are having trouble deducting your loses without proof, the local race track is the easiest and most common way to go. Grab a racing form and a program from the trash, save them and claim them. Then go to the luxury suite and pick up losing tickets from the floor. On a good day, you can pick up $10,000 in just a few losing tickets, make sure you have a matching racing program to go along with it. This is very common and tracks are all over the country and are respected.

Use multiple domestic bank accounts. Use Off shore accounts if you are a high roller. Off shore accounts can be risky if you're not hooked up with the right people.

Cash your checks and If you want to invest and save the cash, buy gold and silver coins and store them in a safe deposit box. Coins are great because there are multiple ways to claim them. Like family heirlooms or 'finding' them in a public storage locker you bought in an auction. I buy coins,and my plans are to pass these down to my kid(s) avoiding multiple layers of taxes.

Good points El Sol.

Multiple banks is a no brainer, spreading activity around.

I also am a huge fan of Gold and Silver American Eagles. Constantly buying when lady luck smiles on me. Would never touch those coins, been doing it many years. They have really appreciated over the years and better than cash long term. I bet a lot of gamblers would struggle to not dig into the stash.

Also love to buy quality guns when I have a nice windfall.

[3runhomer]

Could someone shed some light on how cashing a 3,000 check from a sports book at a local check cashing store is seen?

It obviously never touches or hits your personal account, assuming you keep the cash and don't go deposit it....

[Murray Rothbard]

Could someone shed some light on how cashing a 3,000 check from a sports book at a local check cashing store is seen?

It obviously never touches or hits your personal account, assuming you keep the cash and don't go deposit it....

Just keep in mind those local check cashing stores like to take a nice piece for themselves.