1. #1
    SBR Natalie
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    How to Avoid Taking a Loss when Bitcoin's Value Seesaws

    How to Avoid Taking a Loss when Bitcoin's Value Seesaws

    Hey guys, you may have seen the day's wild range of bitcoin's price. For those of you still new to using bitcoin at sportsbooks, there's an easy way to avoid taking a loss to your bankroll during these volatile days ---- choose sportsbooks that convert your deposit into USD or your native currency. You can find such companies using this rating guide filter.

  2. #2
    Sam Odom
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    Nat

    send Sammy a personalized picture of yourself

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  3. #3
    RoyBacon
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    Was fun while it was going up. Not so fun today.

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  4. #4
    importmoon
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    buy low...

  5. #5
    DISTROYA
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    200 bucks down just overnight....fukkin more criminal than the stock market

  6. #6
    DISTROYA
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    this doesnt address what happens when you get a bitcoin withdrawal, and by the time all clears and youre ready to sell to your bank account it tanks and your left with hundreds less.

  7. #7
    SBR Natalie
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    Quote Originally Posted by DISTROYA View Post
    this doesnt address what happens when you get a bitcoin withdrawal, and by the time all clears and youre ready to sell to your bank account it tanks and your left with hundreds less.
    Hi .. When your sportsbook credits your bitcoin withdrawal, you should immediately transfer from your bitcoin wallet into an exchange. This should take no more than an hour depending on the congestion of the bitcoin network. Coinbase or whatever your exchange is will credit your bank transfer in dollars at the price it was when you sold your bitcoin to them, so even if it takes 2 days to receive the funds in your account, you are not subject to a loss in the time you're waiting. You are only exposed to price moves in the hour or so it takes to transfer and sell your bitcoin.

  8. #8
    BuckyOne
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    I agree with the tactic to get bitcoin to a USD bank account as soon as possible. Now, that we do not have circle and coinbase which can be held in USD - we have risk getting the money to a bank account or from a bank account. I am at the point where using our bank accounts in any way shape or form is a nightmare. We need instant - snap your finger transactions - which you get going to sportsbooks from bitcoin - but the other two parts of the equation are not as easy. Transferring from one book to another is a piece of cake with bit coin - just have to be on the ball the minute the bitcoin hits.

    Back to getting paid - putting money in your bank account - if the sportsbook will pay the old fashioned ways - even a check. But, we are getting stuck at places where money has to go out the same way it came in. Sportsbooks do not complain about paying players with bank wires. That money cannot get seized by the DOJ - those processor accounts can with ************ and checking accounts.

    But, all this is ok - totally reduce the number of banking transactions that caused the DOJ awareness in the first place. So, the atm's - the bitcards - work for small money - big transactions - different story.

    Hey, don't get me wrong - I am grateful for bitcoin - I just want to keep it a long time and not let it implode like Neteller and all the other online banking systems that have not survived.

  9. #9
    Optional
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    Quote Originally Posted by DISTROYA View Post
    200 bucks down just overnight....fukkin more criminal than the stock market
    You should not keep it sitting in a wallet unless you want to invest.

    There was plenty of time to deposit it or swap it to $US after you got paid by BTP.


    Are you sure it wasn't your own choice to hold out with people talking about it hitting 5000 since being paid?

    If you make that choice then you cant really cry criminal at anyone. You just decided to speculate and made the wring choice.


    Should be a great lesson for bettors to ignore the damn price and just use it as the awesome money transfer system it is. No need to speculate and you should not if you are just guessing as well.
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  10. #10
    Sam Odom
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    Quote Originally Posted by Optional View Post

    Should be a great lesson for bettors to ignore the damn price and just use it as the awesome money transfer system it is.

    ...

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  11. #11
    BrickJames
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    The wild swings add to the fun of Bitcoin. It's a gambler's dream currency

  12. #12
    Dan Kelly
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    Trumps DoJ & AG are going to make Bitcoin worthless. They'll legislate, and then prosecute, the end of non-government currencies - mainly because they can not collect taxes on Bitcoin and money launderers love Bitcoin. I wish I were wrong about this, but y'all better be ready for it - unlike the Dems, ending Bitcoin is in the Republicans wheelhouse.

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  13. #13
    Sam Odom
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Kelly View Post

    Trumps DoJ & AG are going to make Bitcoin worthless.

    that is impossible

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  14. #14
    themike78
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Kelly View Post
    Trumps DoJ & AG are going to make Bitcoin worthless. They'll legislate, and then prosecute, the end of non-government currencies - mainly because they can not collect taxes on Bitcoin and money launderers love Bitcoin. I wish I were wrong about this, but y'all better be ready for it - unlike the Dems, ending Bitcoin is in the Republicans wheelhouse.

    BoL
    I agree. Also banks hate bitcoin. I know my bank gives me a hard time and questions me when I do bitcoin transactions. I wish it would stay but I really think it will be the same as what happened to netteller, at least for U.S residents.

  15. #15
    Optional
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Kelly View Post
    Trumps DoJ & AG are going to make Bitcoin worthless. They'll legislate, and then prosecute, the end of non-government currencies - mainly because they can not collect taxes on Bitcoin and money launderers love Bitcoin. I wish I were wrong about this, but y'all better be ready for it - unlike the Dems, ending Bitcoin is in the Republicans wheelhouse.

    BoL

    You'll be pleased to know I think you are completely wrong on all counts then.


    Trump has been appointing pro bitcoin people to key positions.

    There is no "govt currency" now. The reserve owns it. ie the banks.

    Why do you imagine they cant collect tax on bitcoin earnings? Have they not been able to collect tax from people using cash all this time?


    Also not certain how you can twist this to be a dem v gop thing... who do you think is putting the investment into developing systems based on it? Hackers and anti-mainstream people? Or is it the big end of town driving it now?

    Crypto currencies and blockchain technology are going to be a part of your life until you are gone now. US govt could not stop that even with their best resources.... but apart from that they dont even want to. Just regulate it tightly.
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  16. #16
    BrickJames
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    Quote Originally Posted by Optional View Post
    You'll be pleased to know I think you are completely wrong on all counts then.


    Trump has been appointing pro bitcoin people to key positions.

    There is no "govt currency" now. The reserve owns it. ie the banks.

    Why do you imagine they cant collect tax on bitcoin earnings? Have they not been able to collect tax from people using cash all this time?


    Also not certain how you can twist this to be a dem v gop thing... who do you think is putting the investment into developing systems based on it? Hackers and anti-mainstream people? Or is it the big end of town driving it now?

    Crypto currencies and blockchain technology are going to be a part of your life until you are gone now. US govt could not stop that even with their best resources.... but apart from that they dont even want to. Just regulate it tightly.
    Good post

  17. #17
    jjgold
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    basically get your coins in us dollar wallet

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  18. #18
    HedgeHog
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    It's not that difficult. Use bitcoin to transfer between Books, minimizing the time you're in this "funny money". When you need an actual withdrawal to collect a profit, have a check sent. The less time spent in bitcoin the better.

  19. #19
    Russian Rocket
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    So in order to avoid taking a loss as a gambler, you basically need to sell BTC, because this is essentially what happens when you convert BTC to USD.

    But if you're a Bitcoin investor and want to avoid taking a loss (or minimize it), you need to use a 'trailing stop sell' on your BTC orders.

    All major exchanges like Kraken and Bitstamp offer that feature.
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  20. #20
    TheMoneyShot
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Kelly View Post
    Trumps DoJ & AG are going to make Bitcoin worthless. They'll legislate, and then prosecute, the end of non-government currencies - mainly because they can not collect taxes on Bitcoin and money launderers love Bitcoin. I wish I were wrong about this, but y'all better be ready for it - unlike the Dems, ending Bitcoin is in the Republicans wheelhouse.
    BoL
    I'm sure they will try. Don't know if they will be successful or not?

    As for the other comment in this thread of "taxing BTC"... practically impossible.

    Now, if you get audited for whatever reason... a self-employed person... and you have to turn over your bnk records... not too bright to show incoming Bitcoin deposits.

    As for the BTC debit card... best thing ever made. Go ahead and find the trace. Who's to say the $ on the card came from you?

    IRS needs to be absolutely 100% sure you made a profit on those earnings. It's not worth their time to investigate someone on a small scale.

    Everyone needs to get a BTC debit card. It's a no brainer.


    And my advice is... stop constantly sending BTC to and from your bnk. Find other methods.
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  21. #21
    astro61200
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    I'm clueless when it comes to BitCoin.. guess I need to start reading up on it. Haven't ran into any books that I can't just use my PP debit card with so haven't had a need to
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  22. #22
    evo34
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheMoneyShot View Post

    IRS needs to be absolutely 100% sure you made a profit on those earnings.
    What are you basing this on? If the IRS knows that you sold stock for a certain amount, and does not know what you paid for it, subsequently audits you, and you cannot prove what you paid for it...do you think they just say, "Oh, well since we don't know how much profit you made, we're not taxing your proceeds"? They don't need to prove anything in terms of whether someone made a net a profit on incoming money. It's presumed to be profit unless proved otherwise.

    Also, don't you find it a bit odd that all BTC debit card cos. require a SS #?

  23. #23
    evo34
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    In general, if Bitcoin is showing a lot of volatility (like right now), do not try to use it for funds transfers. Wait until it calms down.

  24. #24
    evo34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Russian Rocket View Post
    So in order to avoid taking a loss as a gambler, you basically need to sell BTC, because this is essentially what happens when you convert BTC to USD.

    But if you're a Bitcoin investor and want to avoid taking a loss (or minimize it), you need to use a 'trailing stop sell' on your BTC orders.

    All major exchanges like Kraken and Bitstamp offer that feature.
    Stops are not usually advisable in times of extreme volatility. There is no guarantee of liquidity, so you might sell at some crazy low price because everyone backed away.

  25. #25
    TheMoneyShot
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    Quote Originally Posted by evo34 View Post
    What are you basing this on? If the IRS knows that you sold stock for a certain amount, and does not know what you paid for it, subsequently audits you, and you cannot prove what you paid for it...do you think they just say, "Oh, well since we don't know how much profit you made, we're not taxing your proceeds"? They don't need to prove anything in terms of whether someone made a net a profit on incoming money. It's presumed to be profit unless proved otherwise.

    Also, don't you find it a bit odd that all BTC debit card cos. require a SS #?
    My entire point of the post was... if you give the IRS a reason to audit you... it's simply not too bright to have bitcoin incoming and outgoing on a bnk statement. Most business professionals are considered self-employed especially if you're filing a Schedule C on a tax return.

    Furthermore, yes that bitcoin debit crd everyone talks about does require a SSN. That's a standard requirement by VSA. It's not a guilty charge of you... doing any "wrong doing" per se. What are you doing? Paying bills with it etc. Where did the $ come from? I have no clue.

    Are we comparing apples to apples here? When you are employed by someone... there's always a paper trail. The employer reports your wages... and you file your taxes. If you are self employed you get 1099'd. There's always a paper trail. That's the IRS's evidence. Yes, they need clear cut evidence to support any type of audit.

    Where is the exact paper trail in regards to Bitcoin? Some 27-34 character (however long it is) ID link in cyberspace? With millions of transactions done daily. That's their trail? lol It's not even regulated. The only trace they have is incoming and outgoing Bitcoin on a bnk statement.
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  26. #26
    Russian Rocket
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    Quote Originally Posted by evo34 View Post
    Stops are not usually advisable in times of extreme volatility. There is no guarantee of liquidity, so you might sell at some crazy low price because everyone backed away.
    you're talking about an extremely rare event right now

    Obviously trailing stop is not something you set and forget and you do need to know how to manage it. But it's an effective tool, when used wisely, and it can help you gracefully liquidate a position with either a profit or a limited loss.
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  27. #27
    BuckyOne
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    Quote Originally Posted by HedgeHog View Post
    It's not that difficult. Use bitcoin to transfer between Books, minimizing the time you're in this "funny money". When you need an actual withdrawal to collect a profit, have a check sent. The less time spent in bitcoin the better.
    Well said - I agree 100%! So, now we are at the point that Coinbase and Circle are worthless as an exchange to buy bitcoin. Probably, because of the gambling transfer thing but the bitcoin speculation sounds like there is not taxes being paid on profits?

    So, I read this as no bitcoin exchange based in America is worth a plug nickel for any of us to make bitcoin purchases with transfers from our bank. The only reason we care is because we can store our funds in the exchange in USD. When we do make a bitcoin purchase we move it as soon as the ink is dry.

    Now, on to foreign exchanges that will let us store in a USD wallet?
    We need to get money from our bank account to the foreign exchange. But, now, we have the international problem. Do we have to dance the money in and out of paypal or an international debit card first so our USD bank does not have to do any international transactions of any kind?

    But, I need to learn more about a bitcard and atms that allow deposits that way? Or how you load that???

    LOL! it is all good right? It will feel so good to solve the treasure hunt???

  28. #28
    DISTROYA
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    I never invest in anything anymore. I bought apple once a few years back stock almost got cut in half ( of course tripled after I sold). I bought gold and silver they both tanked like crazy. Even a free feng-shuei reading told me 3 things only with my birthdate and parents birthdates: 1) dont gamble 2) never borrow or lend money 3) never invest in anything. (true story, shocking on the point analysis) anyways, when a payout is received I like to have a few bits so that I can easily deposit to another. To be honest I am scared shitless when I get a payout, as sometimes get sidetracked and before I know it goes up or down. Overall Ive not won or lost when receiving withdrawals/deposits etc. Its just so funny that an imaginary monetary unit has real value and volatility like this.
    Coinbase gouges the shit out of you, charging 10 bucks less when you "sell" this bullshit currency, then they take couple % on top. Oh well, degenerates cant be chooses I guess, still easiest way to get paid I agree.
    Good luck to those investing, it sure is nuts how volatile this thing is.
    I only use bitcoin to get paid/send deposits, because it seems to be the one with least hassle.

  29. #29
    jjgold
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    Move it quick

    This currency was very stable for a while

    Now back to wild swings

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  30. #30
    KVB
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    I sent my BTP payout directly to a book. At this moment, I own zero bitcoin...although I wish that weren't exactly the case.

    Also, I saw some chatter about the IRS...the IRS, I believe, has considered bitcoin an "asset" and will expect records on your transactions. I don't remember the details and apologize for being short there (I've read about the code in detail), but I know they will put a value on it and I believe consider P & L. Google will help there.

    I doubt Bitcoin will be eradicated by the government as you still need to be tied to the system (at least in US) to buy and sell...there's a reason for that.

    The cards want SS like evo says, and to my knowledge we can't get around those identifying factors, not that we want to and all.

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  31. #31
    eberetta1
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  32. #32
    BrickJames
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    The Chinese government old its citizens to be cautious with this currency. That is why the price went down today. Indians and Mexicans and Chinese will keep buying it and push the price back up. Only a matter of time especially with what's going on in India right now.

  33. #33
    BuckyOne
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    Spent the last day trying to get a Bitstamp and Spectrocoin accounts registered and verified - It would be easier to break into Fort Knox. Maybe, it will all be worth it?

  34. #34
    jjgold
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    Bitcoin can easily go to 100 overnight

    That's scary

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  35. #35
    Sam Odom
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    Quote Originally Posted by jjgold View Post
    Bitcoin can easily go to 100 overnight

    That's scary

    or

    1900

    that is crazy

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