1. #1
    stevenash
    stevenash's Avatar Moderator
    Join Date: 01-17-11
    Posts: 62,660
    Betpoints: 32291

    Voters pitch Hall of Fame shutout

    Steroid-tainted stars Barry Bonds, Roger Clemens and Sammy Sosa were denied entry to baseball's Hall of Fame, with voters failing to elect any candidates for only the second time in four decades.

    In a vote that keeps the game's career home run leader and one of its greatest pitchers out of Cooperstown -- at least for now -- Bonds received just 36.2 percent of the vote and Clemens 37.6 in totals announced Wednesday by the Hall and the Baseball Writers' Association of America, both well short of the 75 percent necessary. Sosa, eighth on the career home run list, got 12.5 percent.

    "Curt Schilling made a good point, everyone was guilty. Either you used PEDs, or you did nothing to stop their use," Hall of Famer Mike Schmidt said in an email to The Associated Press. "This generation got rich. Seems there was a price to pay."

    Bonds, Clemens and Sosa were eligible for the first time and have up to 14 more years on the writers' ballot to gain baseball's highest honor.

    "After what has been written and said over the last few years I'm not overly surprised," Clemens said in a statement he posted on Twitter.

    Craig Biggio, 20th on the career list with 3,060 hits, topped the 37 candidates with 68.2 percent of the 569 ballots, 39 shy of election. Among other first-year eligibles, Mike Piazza received 57.8 percent and Schilling 38.8.

    "I think as a player, a group, this is one of the first times that we've been publicly called out," Schilling said. "I think it's fitting. ... If there was ever a ballot and a year to make a statement about what we didn't do as players -- which is we didn't actively push to get the game clean -- this is it."

    Jack Morris led holdovers with 67.7 percent. He will make his final ballot appearance next year, when fellow pitchers Greg Maddux and Tom Glavine along with slugger Frank Thomas are eligible for the first time.
    Two-time NL MVP Dale Murphy received 18.6 percent in his 15th and final appearance.

    "With 53 percent you can get to the White House, but you can't get to Cooperstown," BBWAA secretary-treasurer Jack O'Connell said. "It's the 75 percent that makes it difficult."

    It was the eighth time the BBWAA failed to elect any players. There were four fewer votes than last year and five members submitted blank ballots.

    "It's a tough period for evaluation, that's what this chalks up to," Hall president Jeff Idelson said. "Honestly, I think that any group you put this to would have the same issues. ... There's always going to be discussion and concern about players who didn't get in, but at the end of the day it's a process and again, a snapshot in time isn't one year, it's 15 with this exercise."

    Bonds, baseball's only seven-time Most Valuable Player, hit 762 home runs, including a record 73 in 2001.
    "It is unimaginable that the best player to ever play the game would not be a unanimous first-ballot selection," said Jeff Borris of the Beverly Hills Sports Council, Bonds' longtime agent.

    Clemens, the only seven-time Cy Young Award winner, is third in career strikeouts and ninth in wins.
    "To those who did take the time to look at the facts," Clemens said, "we very much appreciate it."

    Since 1961, the only years the writers didn't elect a candidate were when Yogi Berra topped the 1971 vote by appearing on 67 percent of the ballots cast and when Phil Niekro headed the 1996 ballot at 68 percent. Both were chosen the following years when they achieved the 75 percent necessary for election.

    The other BBWAA elections without a winner were in 1945, 1946, 1950, 1958 and 1960.

    "Next year, I think you'll have a rather large class and this year, for whatever reasons, you had a couple of guys come really close," Commissioner Bud Selig said at the owners' meetings in Paradise Valley, Ariz. "This is not to be voted to make sure that somebody gets in every year. It's to be voted on to make sure that they're deserving. I respect the writers as well as the Hall itself. This idea that this somehow diminishes the Hall of baseball is just ridiculous in my opinion."

    Players' union head Michael Weiner called the vote "unfortunate, if not sad."

    "To ignore the historic accomplishments of Barry Bonds and Roger Clemens, for example, is hard to justify. Moreover, to penalize players exonerated in legal proceedings -- and others never even implicated -- is simply unfair. The Hall of Fame is supposed to be for the best players to have ever played the game. Several such players were denied access to the Hall today. Hopefully this will be rectified by future voting."

    Three inductees were chosen last month by the 16-member panel considering individuals from the era before integration in 1947: Yankees owner Jacob Ruppert, umpire Hank O'Day and barehanded catcher Deacon White. They will be enshrined during a ceremony in Cooperstown on July 28, when the Hall also will honor Lou Gehrig and Rogers Hornsby among a dozen players who never received formal inductions because of restrictions during World War II.

    Bonds has denied knowingly using performance-enhancing drugs and was convicted of one count of obstruction of justice for giving an evasive answer in 2003 to a grand jury investigating PEDs. Clemens was acquitted of perjury charges stemming from congressional testimony during which he denied using PEDs.
    Sosa, who finished with 609 home runs, was among those who tested positive in MLB's 2003 anonymous survey, The New York Times reported in 2009. He told a congressional committee in 2005 that he never took illegal performance-enhancing drugs.

    The BBWAA election rules say "voting shall be based upon the player's record, playing ability, integrity, sportsmanship, character, and contributions to the team(s) on which the player played."

    An Associated Press survey of 112 eligible voters conducted in late November after the ballot was announced indicated Bonds, Clemens and Sosa would fall well short of 50 percent. The big three drew even less support than that as the debate raged over who was Hall worthy.

    Voters are writers who have been members of the BBWAA for 10 consecutive years at any point.
    BBWAA president Susan Slusser of the San Francisco Chronicle said she didn't vote for Bonds, Clemens or Sosa.

    "The evidence for steroid use is too strong," she said.

    As for Biggio, "I'm surprised he didn't get in."

    MLB.com's Hal Bodley, the former baseball columnist for USA Today, said Biggio and others paid the price for other players using PEDs.

    "They got caught in the undertow of the steroids thing," he said.

    Bodley said this BBWAA vote was a "loud and clear" message on the steroids issue. He said he couldn't envision himself voting for stars linked to drugs.

    We've a forgiving society, I know that," he said. "But I have too great a passion for the sport."

    Mark McGwire, 10th on the career home run list, received 16.9 percent on his seventh try, down from 19.5 last year. He received 23.7 percent in 2010 -- a vote before he admitted using steroids and human growth hormone.

    Rafael Palmeiro, among just four players with 500 homers and 3,000 hits along with Hank Aaron, Willie Mays and Eddie Murray, received 8.8 percent in his third try, down from 12.6 percent last year. Palmeiro received a 10-day suspension in 2005 for a positive test for performance-enhancing drugs, claiming it was due to a vitamin vial given to him by teammate Miguel Tejada.

    While there are exhibits about the Steroids Era at the Hall, the plaque room will remain without Bonds and Clemens, who join career hits leader Pete Rose on the outside looking in. There were four write-in votes for Rose, who never appeared on the ballot because of his lifetime ban that followed an investigation of his gambling while manager of theCincinnati Reds.

    Morris increased slightly from his 66.7 percent last year, when Barry Larkin was elected. Morris could become the player with the highest-percentage of the vote who is not in the Hall, a mark currently held by Gil Hodges at 63 percent in 1983.

    Several players who fell just short in the BBWAA balloting later were elected by either the Veterans Committee or Old-Timers' Committee: Nellie Fox (74.7 percent on the 1985 BBWAA ballot), Jim Bunning (74.2 percent in 1988), Orlando Cepeda (73.6 percent in 1994) and Frank Chance (72.5 percent in 1945).

    The ace of three World Series winners, Morris had 254 victories and was the winningest pitcher of the 1980s. His 3.90 ERA, however, is higher than that of any Hall of Famer.



  2. #2
    stevenash
    stevenash's Avatar Moderator
    Join Date: 01-17-11
    Posts: 62,660
    Betpoints: 32291

    2013 Hall of Fame voting

    For the first time since 1996, no players were elected to the Hall of Fame by baseball writers. A player needs at least 75 percent of the vote to gain election.
    Player Votes Pct
    Craig Biggio 388 68.2
    Jack Morris 385 67.7
    Jeff Bagwell 339 59.6
    Mike Piazza 329 57.8
    Tim Raines 297 52.2
    Lee Smith 272 47.8
    Curt Schilling 221 38.8
    Roger Clemens 214 37.6
    Barry Bonds 206 36.2
    Edgar Martinez 204 35.9
    Alan Trammell 191 33.6
    Larry Walker 123 21.6
    Fred McGriff 118 20.7
    Dale Murphy 106 18.6
    Mark McGwire 96 16.9
    Don Mattingly 75 13.2
    Sammy Sosa 71 12.5
    Rafael Palmeiro 50 8.8
    Others receiving votes: Bernie Williams, 19; Kenny Lofton, 18; Sandy Alomar Jr., 16; Julio Franco, 6; David Wells, 5; Steve Finley, 4; Shawn Green, 2; Aaron Sele, 1.

  3. #3
    boeing power
    boeing power's Avatar Become A Pro!
    Join Date: 03-23-10
    Posts: 9,698
    Betpoints: 56

    Top vote getter should get in , too many voters have an agenda.

  4. #4
    InTheDrink
    Drinker of the Year
    InTheDrink's Avatar Become A Pro!
    Join Date: 11-23-09
    Posts: 23,983
    Betpoints: 527

    biggio and lee smith should be in based on past inductions

    joke

  5. #5
    k13
    k13's Avatar Become A Pro!
    Join Date: 07-16-10
    Posts: 17,537
    Betpoints: 1830

    Unbiased voting. lol

    Makes the HOF look like an even bigger joke.

  6. #6
    str
    Nothing's easy
    str's Avatar SBR PRO
    Join Date: 01-12-09
    Posts: 9,988
    Betpoints: 68545

    I saw Tim Kurkjian explaining this last night on the baseball channel. He said that his ballot and everyone's ballot was a mess.

    Something will eventually get worked out but for now, this says a very loud something. I am not sure exactly what, but we all get it and so do the players.

    There will need to be several Mea Culpa's along the way but in time it will sort itself out I suppose. Shilling has already started that dialogue.

    So as for me, I agree with the writers .

    Sometimes saying or doing nothing speaks volumes.

  7. #7
    stevenash
    stevenash's Avatar Moderator
    Join Date: 01-17-11
    Posts: 62,660
    Betpoints: 32291

    Who's the ass clown that voted for Aaron Sele?

  8. #8
    stevenash
    stevenash's Avatar Moderator
    Join Date: 01-17-11
    Posts: 62,660
    Betpoints: 32291

    Quote Originally Posted by str View Post
    I saw Tim Kurkjian explaining this last night on the baseball channel. He said that his ballot and everyone's ballot was a mess.

    Something will eventually get worked out but for now, this says a very loud something. I am not sure exactly what, but we all get it and so do the players.

    There will need to be several Mea Culpa's along the way but in time it will sort itself out I suppose. Shilling has already started that dialogue.

    So as for me, I agree with the writers .

    Sometimes saying or doing nothing speaks volumes.

    I have no problem with nobody this year.
    Good post by the way Str

  9. #9
    Mitchell88
    Mitchell88's Avatar Become A Pro!
    Join Date: 12-16-12
    Posts: 4,334
    Betpoints: 37

    great post stevenash, this is BS IMO. thanks for all the info cause I dont get any of it as of right now. MLB knew what was going on to get the fans back in after the lockouts. They succeded know everyone wants to be a moral crusader? All of this is dumb just vote and use the f'n asteris if you have to let get one with it. once again great post

  10. #10
    trytrytry
    All I do is trytrytry
    trytrytry's Avatar SBR PRO
    Join Date: 03-13-06
    Posts: 23,503
    Betpoints: 273617

    all the more reason to never attend that joke of a museum..

  11. #11
    str
    Nothing's easy
    str's Avatar SBR PRO
    Join Date: 01-12-09
    Posts: 9,988
    Betpoints: 68545

    Quote Originally Posted by stevenash View Post
    Who's the ass clown that voted for Aaron Sele?

  12. #12
    d2bets
    d2bets's Avatar SBR PRO
    Join Date: 08-10-05
    Posts: 39,777
    Betpoints: 21665

    I want to know who voted for Aaron Sele.

  13. #13
    Regul8er
    Wordd
    Regul8er's Avatar Become A Pro!
    Join Date: 11-06-07
    Posts: 10,666
    Betpoints: 4101

    Still cant figure out why Trammell doesnt get more love!

    Also, very surprised to see Lofton kicked off he ballot his first year. I dont think he's HOF material, but he deserved better fate then this.

  14. #14
    Regul8er
    Wordd
    Regul8er's Avatar Become A Pro!
    Join Date: 11-06-07
    Posts: 10,666
    Betpoints: 4101

    Nothing will change next year in terms of guys on the current ballot getting in. Biggio is getting close, but won't get another 7% in one year.

    I'm think Greg Maddux and Frank Thomas are getting in on their first ballot next year.

  15. #15
    stevenash
    stevenash's Avatar Moderator
    Join Date: 01-17-11
    Posts: 62,660
    Betpoints: 32291

    Nice to see Bernie get a little love.
    Stellar career, not Hall worthy, but brilliant outfielder

  16. #16
    15805
    15805's Avatar Become A Pro!
    Join Date: 06-10-12
    Posts: 3,604
    Betpoints: 16182

    Glad the steroiders were dismissed so lightly, they made video game stats that damaged the game. The weirdest stat
    was Sosa hitting over 60 HR's 3 times without leading the league in HR's each time he hit over 60!

    2 players are very deserving but rarely considered with far more credentials than all eligible in 2013!

    1. Lefty O'Doul .349 lifetime hitter, had only 4 years when he was eligible for the batting title won twice, the other
    2 years he batted .383 & .336. Still holds the NL record for hits in a season with 254! Second only to DiMaggio in
    HR to Strikeout ratio. Struckout 122 times with 113 HR's.

    2. Junior Stephens: 1st of the power hitting SS, batted 4th behind Williams for the powerhouse Redsox offenses from 48-50.
    during that span had 440 RBI's no player since playing any position even in the steroid era had as many RBI's in a 3 YEAR
    SPAN. He also was the first SS ever to lead the league in HR's. More incredibly Stephens in 44 & 45 hit more HR's than
    all the other starting AL shortstops combined, I don't think that was ever accomplished by any other player ever.

    These men had video game stats and they did it without steroids.

  17. #17
    KingJD31
    KingJD31's Avatar Become A Pro!
    Join Date: 11-04-11
    Posts: 8,167
    Betpoints: 7042

    Biggio should be in,bagwell and piazza also since they have the least proof of steroids and obviously have hall of fame numbers. bonds and mcgwire were amazing before roids they should be in

  18. #18
    Ghenghis Kahn
    Best Baller on SBR
    Ghenghis Kahn's Avatar SBR PRO
    Join Date: 01-02-12
    Posts: 19,735
    Betpoints: 2261

    baseball hall of fame is a joke.

    bagwell and piazza were also on roids.

    people forget, sosa and mcgwire saved the league.

    the league knew players were taking roids.

    to save their faces, they have to throw them under the bus.

    typical...

  19. #19
    daneblazer
    Most Well Rounded POY
    daneblazer's Avatar SBR PRO
    Join Date: 09-14-08
    Posts: 27,837
    Betpoints: 5652

    What a fukkin joke. You can't tell me none of these guys belong in the HOF

  20. #20
    rsnnh12
    rsnnh12's Avatar Become A Pro!
    Join Date: 09-26-10
    Posts: 3,487
    Betpoints: 205

    Steroids have been known to be in baseball since the 60s. Amphetamines have been in baseball even longer, and guys like Willie Mays, Hank Aaron, Mike Schmidt, and Willie Stargell have all either admitted to or been accused of using and distributing them to teammates.

    Schmidt- "amphetamine use in baseball is both far more common and has been going on a lot longer than steroid abuse."

    If the Hall is so pristine, why are these guys allowed in? What happens if it comes out that a Dimaggio, Ted Williams, Babe Ruth type used steroids? Do they take them out of the Hall?

    The Hall of Fame should be for the best players ever. Period. It should include both the positive aspects of the sport and its athletes, as well as the darker side. Propping these guys up as untouchable is completely insane. They are human after all. The best players should be in. Only exceptions should be for guys who intentionally threw games.

  21. #21
    15805
    15805's Avatar Become A Pro!
    Join Date: 06-10-12
    Posts: 3,604
    Betpoints: 16182

    Quote Originally Posted by rsnnh12 View Post
    Steroids have been known to be in baseball since the 60s. Amphetamines have been in baseball even longer, and guys like Willie Mays, Hank Aaron, Mike Schmidt, and Willie Stargell have all either admitted to or been accused of using and distributing them to teammates.

    Schmidt- "amphetamine use in baseball is both far more common and has been going on a lot longer than steroid abuse."

    If the Hall is so pristine, why are these guys allowed in? What happens if it comes out that a Dimaggio, Ted Williams, Babe Ruth type used steroids? Do they take them out of the Hall?

    The Hall of Fame should be for the best players ever. Period. It should include both the positive aspects of the sport and its athletes, as well as the darker side. Propping these guys up as untouchable is completely insane. They are human after all. The best players should be in. Only exceptions should be for guys who intentionally threw games.
    Comparing amphetamines to steroid use is like comparing a cold to pneumonia don't do it. When a guy like Sosa hit 60 HR's
    3 times without leading the league in homers tainted all the records of the steroid era. Obvious users should be locked out
    & they will. Piazza is a H of F player eventually he'll get in. Biggio shouldn't this isn't the Hall of longevity, Bagwell is iffy.

    The Hall has some pretty unworthy members one is Rick Ferrell a catcher in the 30's & 40's. Ferrell played about 15 years
    & had 38 HR's. His brother a star pitcher Wes hit 39HR's & had a higher lifetime Batting Average than Rick. There are some
    some members with pretty pedestrian stats in the Hall & in the future more will come.

  22. #22
    Ghenghis Kahn
    Best Baller on SBR
    Ghenghis Kahn's Avatar SBR PRO
    Join Date: 01-02-12
    Posts: 19,735
    Betpoints: 2261

    Quote Originally Posted by 15805 View Post
    Comparing amphetamines to steroid use is like comparing a cold to pneumonia don't do it.


    is this a joke?

    you are ignorant to think speed isn't a ped.

    let's face it. baseball is a dying sport.

    the whole sport needs a modern intervention and i'm not talking getting rid of peds...

  23. #23
    Pluthero
    Pluthero's Avatar Become A Pro!
    Join Date: 12-09-09
    Posts: 992
    Betpoints: 54

    Quote Originally Posted by Ghenghis Kahn View Post


    is this a joke?

    you are ignorant to think speed isn't a ped.

    let's face it. baseball is a dying sport.

    the whole sport needs a modern intervention and i'm not talking getting rid of peds...
    Attendance was up 1.8% from 2011. I think that hardly qualifies as a "dying sport".

  24. #24
    Cuse0323
    Cuse0323's Avatar Become A Pro!
    Join Date: 12-09-09
    Posts: 30,169
    Betpoints: 87

    Meh, who cares really. Baseball has proven to be a joke, players have been cheating since the beginning just in different ways. Cooperstown sucks anyway.

Top