1. #1
    KDOWNS
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    Bitcoin Confusion

    Good Afternoon

    For the last few months, I have really been trying to learn more and more about Bitcoin, and have to gotten to know it pretty good, except for a couple of things that are confusing.

    I watch the unconfirmed transaction pretty often, and that helps me decide, if it is a good time to deposit, send, withdraw, etc. I like to use bitcoin when there are a low number of unconfirmed transactions, so it gets to where I want it to go faster, but lately it's been the opposite

    Example: Yesterday, I made a deposit with 6500 unconfirmed, and it took 4 hours to finally get confirmed. I did not use the advance send because of the low number unconfirmed. Even slow to get to Blockchain from coinbase. Today I send with 38,000 and everything hits instantly. Am I missing something, or do all of you agree it does not make any sense. Curious to know if this happens to anyone else. I know it gets delayed a lot, but it seems to be the opposite of what you think would happen.

  2. #2
    themike78
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    I really think there is no way of knowing. Some of my transactions clear in ,5 minutes, some take 24 hours. It's extremely frustrating and I think I am going to stop using bitcoin because of this and start using the old fashioned money transfer to deposit and withdraw. At least with those you can call customer service and find out what's going on. There is no 800 number for bitcoin. I still don't trust it.

  3. #3
    KDOWNS
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    Quote Originally Posted by themike78 View Post
    I really think there is no way of knowing. Some of my transactions clear in ,5 minutes, some take 24 hours. It's extremely frustrating and I think I am going to stop using bitcoin because of this and start using the old fashioned money transfer to deposit and withdraw. At least with those you can call customer service and find out what's going on. There is no 800 number for bitcoin. I still don't trust it.
    I don't think I am to that point yet,its too convenient. I like messing around with it, but it is very frustrating when they do take so long to confirm, and like you said there really is no way of knowing. Like I said above, the opposite happens of what you think should happen at times.

  4. #4
    DroopyDog
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    increase miners fee to .0008 and it will always confirm in next block, even if its unnecessary , who cares? we are talking pennies here

  5. #5
    KDOWNS
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    Quote Originally Posted by DroopyDog View Post
    increase miners fee to .0008 and it will always confirm in next block, even if its unnecessary , who cares? we are talking pennies here
    that's what I have been doing and you are correct

  6. #6
    themike78
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    Most places won't let you increase the fee. And a lot of times that has no effect anyways. It's a gamble everytime not knowing how long it will take to confirm

  7. #7
    ezeemunee
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    going on 5 hours for a BITCOIN send and still showing ZERO confirmations

  8. #8
    DroopyDog
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    Quote Originally Posted by themike78 View Post
    Most places won't let you increase the fee. And a lot of times that has no effect anyways. It's a gamble everytime not knowing how long it will take to confirm
    Saying it has no effect is simply wrong. Its the single biggest factor as to if your transaction is confirmed in the next block or not

  9. #9
    themike78
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    Quote Originally Posted by DroopyDog View Post
    Saying it has no effect is simply wrong. Its the single biggest factor as to if your transaction is confirmed in the next block or not
    It's not true at all. There are several articles about it. There are several other factors and the fee has little to do with it.

  10. #10
    Jowframs
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    Delays in bitcoin.......Delays...part of the game

  11. #11
    scavsiu8
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    Ive probably done 500 bitcoin transactions and never once did one take more than an hour.

    It shocks me people have this many issues with something so simple

  12. #12
    Jowframs
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    Quote Originally Posted by scavsiu8 View Post
    Ive probably done 500 bitcoin transactions and never once did one take more than an hour.

    It shocks me people have this many issues with something so simple
    Big Amounts do have BIG DELAYS

  13. #13
    scavsiu8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jowframs View Post
    Big Amounts do have BIG DELAYS
    Had multiple max withdrawals from one of the big 3, and also low 4 digit deposits, no issues

    Never had any 5 digit transactions though

  14. #14
    Waterstpub87
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    After using bitcoin, I could never go back to P2P methods. You have to get used to it, and then it is fine.

    If you are worried about it, here is what I normally do:

    1. Check address obsessively. Check it 10 times before you send. Copy and paste the address from the book, and the address from your bitcoin wallet into excel, and make sure they are equal

    2. When receiving:
    Take a screenshot of your request along side your bitcoin wallet. That way, if something goes wrong, you have evidence that you typed in the right address

    Do the opposite when sending

    Take screen shots at every part of the way so that you evidence that you weren't wrong on your side.
    Last edited by Waterstpub87; 02-16-17 at 10:15 PM.

  15. #15
    Optional
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    Do you realize that when sending a wire between different currencies you are forced to wait 8-36 hours between ordering and fulfillment and have always been subject to fluctuations over this period?

    And before you start telling me btc has bigger fluctuations, be aware that a $20 swing in btc to USD is the same as a 1 cent swing in the USD to CAD exchange rate, percentage wise.

    4 hours is still better than anything else on offer in the way of online transfers with currency conversion involved but in most cases it happens in 10-20 mins.

    You guys are just obsessing over things that can't be avoided anywhere right now and are already better with btc than regular banking.

    If you are not subject to these swings yourself then you are paying higher fees to someone who will take the risk onboard themselves.


    I'd guess checking the MemPool state is probably a more accurate way to guess on delays than the unconfirmed queue btw. Not that that would be completely accurate either.


    The poster that claimed the larger value of the transaction the more likely a delay is just talking absolute 100% garbage. The $ value in no way comes into calculations. The byte size, fee size and network state are what affect the transfer time. Zero to do with the dollar value.


    @Waterspub... there is zero use going through all that crap. There has not been a single case of anyone ever inputting a typo address and it going through. Not once ever. No need to be obsessing over that as well. It's an imagined problem that just "cant happen" the odds are so ridiculously large of doing it. And who do you plan to present all this evidence to if your imagined problem ever came true anyway?
    Last edited by Optional; 02-17-17 at 06:54 AM.
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  16. #16
    Optional
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jowframs View Post
    Big Amounts do have BIG DELAYS
    Absolute complete rubbish.
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  17. #17
    Waterstpub87
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    Quote Originally Posted by Optional View Post
    Do you realize that when sending a wire between different currencies you are forced to wait 8-36 hours between ordering and fulfillment and have always been subject to fluctuations over this period?

    And before you start telling me btc has bigger fluctuations, be aware that a $20 swing in btc to USD is the same as a 1 cent swing in the USD to CAD exchange rate, percentage wise.

    4 hours is still better than anything else on offer in the way of online transfers with currency conversion involved but in most cases it happens in 10-20 mins.

    You guys are just obsessing over things that can't be avoided anywhere right now and are already better with btc than regular banking.

    If you are not subject to these swings yourself then you are paying higher fees to someone who will take the risk onboard themselves.


    I'd guess checking the MemPool state is probably a more accurate way to guess on delays than the unconfirmed queue btw. Not that that would be completely accurate either.


    The poster that claimed the larger value of the transaction the more likely a delay is just talking absolute 100% garbage. The $ value in no way comes into calculations. The byte size, fee size and network state are what affect the transfer time. Zero to do with the dollar value.


    @Waterspub... there is zero use going through all that crap. There has not been a single case of anyone ever inputting a typo address and it going through. Not once ever. No need to be obsessing over that as well. It's an imagined problem that just "cant happen" the odds are so ridiculously large of doing it. And who do you plan to present all this evidence to if your imagined problem ever came true anyway?
    I obsess about details and things of that nature, so I would do it anyway. Granted, because of the larger number of addresses, I guess it would be hard to miss a letter or something and send to a wrong address.

    What is the process that happens if you send to a wrong address? will it immediately say "null transaction" or something of that sort? Is that instant, or is your money hanging in the wind somewhere while that gets fixed?

    Taking screenshots would be for if a book said they didn't get a deposit, or sent a withdraw and I hadn't received it. I would have that evidence for you guys, if I filled a compliant.

  18. #18
    Optional
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    Quote Originally Posted by Waterstpub87 View Post

    I obsess about details and things of that nature, so I would do it anyway. Granted, because of the larger number of addresses, I guess it would be hard to miss a letter or something and send to a wrong address.

    What is the process that happens if you send to a wrong address? will it immediately say "null transaction" or something of that sort? Is that instant, or is your money hanging in the wind somewhere while that gets fixed?

    Taking screenshots would be for if a book said they didn't get a deposit, or sent a withdraw and I hadn't received it. I would have that evidence for you guys, if I filled a compliant.
    The reason it's not really possible to get the address wrong is that the first part of it is the actual address and the second part of it is a checksum string calculated from the address.

    If the address is not valid then your wallet will either reject the send or the network will reject it. In either case you wont lose your funds.

    If taking screenshots make you feel better thats fine but suggesting it is important just re-enforces a lack of faith in the system that isnt justified. If a transaction is not on the public blockchain a book isn't really going to care what screenshot you might have I dont think.
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  19. #19
    Waterstpub87
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    Quote Originally Posted by Optional View Post
    The reason it's not really possible to get the address wrong is that the first part of it is the actual address and the second part of it is a checksum string calculated from the address.

    If the address is not valid then your wallet will either reject the send or the network will reject it. In either case you wont lose your funds.

    If taking screenshots make you feel better thats fine but suggesting it is important just re-enforces a lack of faith in the system that isnt justified. If a transaction is not on the public blockchain a book isn't really going to care what screenshot you might have I dont think.
    And how do I prove that the address that I sent to is the one the book gave me?

  20. #20
    Optional
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    Quote Originally Posted by Waterstpub87 View Post

    And how do I prove that the address that I sent to is the one the book gave me?
    If you really sent anything you can supply the transaction ID and all the details are recorded on the public blockchain record.


    I guess taking a shot of the screen on the book site showing the send to address could be useful. But I dont think I have ever heard of a book denying they owned an address a player sent to.
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  21. #21
    Waterstpub87
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    I feel relieved that the system is more fool proof then I believed. Will still be completely OCD about it however, was the same way with p2p, about making sure everything was spelled correctly.

  22. #22
    Optional
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    There will probably be a case some time where doing all that really would be helpful. I'll think back to this conversation if it ever happens
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  23. #23
    KDOWNS
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    Quote Originally Posted by Optional View Post
    Do you realize that when sending a wire between different currencies you are forced to wait 8-36 hours between ordering and fulfillment and have always been subject to fluctuations over this period?

    And before you start telling me btc has bigger fluctuations, be aware that a $20 swing in btc to USD is the same as a 1 cent swing in the USD to CAD exchange rate, percentage wise.

    4 hours is still better than anything else on offer in the way of online transfers with currency conversion involved but in most cases it happens in 10-20 mins.

    You guys are just obsessing over things that can't be avoided anywhere right now and are already better with btc than regular banking.

    If you are not subject to these swings yourself then you are paying higher fees to someone who will take the risk onboard themselves.


    I'd guess checking the MemPool state is probably a more accurate way to guess on delays than the unconfirmed queue btw. Not that that would be completely accurate either.


    The poster that claimed the larger value of the transaction the more likely a delay is just talking absolute 100% garbage. The $ value in no way comes into calculations. The byte size, fee size and network state are what affect the transfer time. Zero to do with the dollar value.


    @Waterspub... there is zero use going through all that crap. There has not been a single case of anyone ever inputting a typo address and it going through. Not once ever. No need to be obsessing over that as well. It's an imagined problem that just "cant happen" the odds are so ridiculously large of doing it. And who do you plan to present all this evidence to if your imagined problem ever came true anyway?
    That unconfirmed report baffles me, like I stated to start this thread. I will not make a decision only on that anymore, but I will start looking at the Mempool. I also have been using that advance send feature, and that works pretty good. 95% of the time, it is included in the next block. It also is very in expensive to use, but worth it if you want the transaction approved quickly.

  24. #24
    Optional
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    Quote Originally Posted by KDOWNS View Post
    That unconfirmed report baffles me, like I stated to start this thread. I will not make a decision only on that anymore, but I will start looking at the Mempool. I also have been using that advance send feature, and that works pretty good. 95% of the time, it is included in the next block. It also is very in expensive to use, but worth it if you want the transaction approved quickly.
    I don't really know a reliable way to estimate but have you seen this thread?

    How to speed up a delayed bitcoin transaction - Viabtc txaccelorator

    Raiders posted an article in there about working out delay from your node's mempool too.
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  25. #25
    KDOWNS
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    Quote Originally Posted by Optional View Post
    I don't really know a reliable way to estimate but have you seen this thread?

    How to speed up a delayed bitcoin transaction - Viabtc txaccelorator

    Raiders posted an article in there about working out delay from your node's mempool too.

    Thanks Optional, I was just looking at that. Have you used it?, If so how does it work

  26. #26
    raiders72001
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    Quote Originally Posted by themike78 View Post
    It's not true at all. There are several articles about it. There are several other factors and the fee has little to do with it.
    You are correct that at one time this was true but it has changed. Now a higher fee does the trick.

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