[rangerz2478]

Betonline had props on Donald Trump's speech last night. One of the wagers read the following word for word:

Politics - Republican National Convention - Donald Trump speech: build a wall - Uses complete phrase

I had wagers on yes. He said the following during the speech:

"We are going to build a great border wall to stop illegal immigration"

http://www.latimes.com/politics/la-na-pol-donald-trump-convention-speech-transcript-20160721-snap-htmlstory.html


Betonline graded the wager as a loss. Nowhere in the rules did it say he must use the complete phrase in order. It simply said he will use the complete phrase, and that is exactly what he did.

[Optional]

Seriously?

Phrase, in part, means set of words... not words scattered about within a sentence.

[rangerz2478]

Seriously?

Phrase, in part, means set of words... not words scattered about within a sentence.

Scattered about? He didn't randomly pull the 3 words together out of nowhere. He used build a wall in the same sentence.

[Optional]

Not in the same complete phrase though.

Stop it, this is one of the saddest angle shots I've ever seen posted.

[rangerz2478]

So he says the exact phrase and adds an adjective in between and its one of the saddest angles you've seen posted on here?

Yea, this is right up there with the people take a shot on something random with no knowledge of the actual rules of the sportsbook. There is no case to be made here. Cmon now.

[rangerz2478]

You can disagree with me and that's fine. But to say what you just said as someone who is supposed to be impartial is mind boggling on every level.

[Optional]

You can disagree with me and that's fine. But to say what you just said as someone who is supposed to be impartial is mind boggling on every level.

Sorry, I was trying to be a bit light hearted about it.

But seriously, don't think you have a case.

[Swinging Johnson]

Below is an article I wrote on some of the props but not build a wall.

Looks like we hit all but one (All Lives Matter)...According to my word doc Trump's speech went not so surprisingly went waaaay over (5294 words)


Donald Trump Speech: All Lives MatterUses complete phrase +190
Does not use complete phrase -240


Personally, I like the live dog here. It’s a quick, surefire way to get a thunderous applause and Trump likes nothing more than watching the masses genuflect at his altar. Grab the +190 here as a strong betting pick.




Donald Trump Speech: Bernie Sanders
Uses complete phrase -150
Does not use complete phrase +120


Trump needs Sanders’ supporters and understands the contempt many of them have for his former rival, Hillary Clinton. They will not necessarily follow their champion into the Clinton camp because many of them feel betrayed by Bernie’s sudden defection to mainstream politics and business as usual. Trump will try to appeal to Sanders’ disenfranchised base and will look to position himself as an outsider, just like dear old Bernie. Take the -150 betting odds to the bank.




Donald Trump Speech: Color of Tie
Red -400
Blue +350
Field (any other color) +1000


Seriously folks, does he own any other color? It’s a power color and if he ever wanted to show the world his enormous hands…check that…his colossal clout, then this is the perfect stage to do so. Lay the lumber and like it at -400.




Donald Trump Speech: Crooked Hillary
Over 4½ uses of phrase +150
Under 4½ uses of phrase -180


Trump will undeniably use the term “Crooked Hillary” but let’s not forget this night is all about his favorite person, Donald Trump, not his arch enemy. He will not overdo it, not because he’s not prone to overdoing just about everything, but because he will get a chance to talk to a national audience about the wonders of - who else? Donald Trump. Lay the -180.




Donald Trump Speech: Total Words
Over 4249½ total words -115
Under 4249½ total words -115


I’m not sure the oddsmakers could deal a number in which I wouldn’t go over the posted total. I have recently learned that for every minute of a speech there are 100-200 words. Donald doesn’t talk particularly fast but he does go long. If Trump stays on the podium for 20 minutes we have a better than decent shot at this prop going over the posted total. I say they’ll have to start playing the music – ala Oscar winners going too long – before he’ll drop the mic. Let’s go over -115 at BetOnline.

[squareshot]

Optional,
Saying "Stop it, this is one of the saddest angle shots I've ever seen posted"
Isn't lighthearted at all. Its actually quite the opposite.

This isn't open and shut at all. As usual you have expresssed an opinion that strongly favors the book instantly. One of the saddest examples of objectiveness I've ever seen posted.

[rangerz2478]

Optional,
Saying "Stop it, this is one of the saddest angle shots I've ever seen posted"
Isn't lighthearted at all. Its actually quite the opposite.

This isn't open and shut at all. As usual you have expresssed an opinion that strongly favors the book instantly. One of the saddest examples of objectiveness I've ever seen posted.

I like Optional, but I agree he was completely out of line on an issue that IS 100% debatable no matter what side you're on.

That said, I have seen him take the players side and I don't see him as someone who automatically takes the book side, but I was surprised at his comment here.

[Optional]

You can shoot in a complaint still if you like http://www.sportsbookreview.com/sportsbook-complaint/

My word is just opinion and Admin guys will still look at it.

[squareshot]

Optional,

lol hopefully you get put on the case

what a joke.

[michael777]

should be a win,I expect nothing better from that shit book who charges 6% for bitcoin deposits

[Bill Dozer]

I hate these props. They need to come with a sheet of rules for each one. After 20 years of offering them, books still run into scenarios they wish they covered.

In this one where do you draw the line? Is "build a big wall" a loser? "Build walls" around the borders a loser? "the wall" ?

If the book states "exact phrase"? That makes it clear.

[4nic8ing]

They listed the phrase. To me it seems obvious this was a 3 word phrase and hence it is graded correctly. If they said "uses these words" then he would have a claim.

[rangerz2478]

I hate these props. They need to come with a sheet of rules for each one. After 20 years of offering them, books still run into scenarios they wish they covered.

In this one where do you draw the line? Is "build a big wall" a loser? "Build walls" around the borders a loser? "the wall" ?

If the book states "exact phrase"? That makes it clear.

IMG_1349.pdf

Exact wording attached above. It says complete phrase, NOT exact phrase. Note, if you go to the current odds for the Clinton speech they changed it to the following:

Screen Shot 2016-07-26 at 2.33.31 PM.pdf

NOW the wagers say "exact phrase." If my wager said exact phrase, I wouldn't have a case. But that is NOT what it said. It's clear that they realize the wager was mis-worded and at the very least it should be no actioned. I did speak to one of my top contacts at betonline who said there is nothing he can do. I have not filed a complaint yet, but I feel like I have a legit case for the wagers to be no actioned at the very least. (I had multiple wagers on it, not just the one attached here.)

[rangerz2478]

Didn't mean to attach them where they had to be downloaded but my wager said the following:

"must use complete phrase" and now on the Clinton bets they changed it to "must use exact phrase."

There is a huge difference between the two.

[SBR Forum]

The player hasn't written in officially so it looks like he's seeking opinions first.

Donald Trump speech: build a wall - Uses complete phrase

The above makes clear that the complete phrase is required. A specific phrase is given. Using the phrase partially or using the words of the phrase in a different order wouldn't satisfy the requirement of using the complete phrase. If it were not qualified like it is and instead only said uses phrase or words, that would be way more general and you'd have a better case. It's not reasonable to think you could change or customize a given phrase but think that you have used the phrase completely.

"Exact" is better, though, because it is even clearer and takes away the possibility of angle-shooting as others mentioned.

They listed the phrase. To me it seems obvious this was a 3 word phrase and hence it is graded correctly. If they said "uses these words" then he would have a claim.

Agreed.

[rangerz2478]

The player hasn't written in officially so it looks like he's seeking opinions first.

Donald Trump speech: build a wall - Uses complete phrase

The above makes clear that the complete phrase is required. A specific phrase is given. Using the phrase partially or using the words of the phrase in a different order wouldn't satisfy the requirement of using the complete phrase. If it were not qualified like it is and instead only said uses phrase or words, that would be way more general and you'd have a better case. It's not reasonable to think you could change or customize a given phrase but think that you have used the phrase completely.

"Exact" is better, though, because it is even clearer and takes away the possibility of angle-shooting as others mentioned.




Agreed.

SBRforum, as I said earlier if he randomly threw the 3 words together randomly then there would be nothing to discuss. But he DID use the "complete" phrase with an adjective in between. It sounds like it is completely agreed upon by everyone in here that had the phrase said "exact" (as they now changed it to for the Clinton speech" this all would be a moot point. But it is clear as day that they changed the Clinton rules to exact because of this case. It sounds to me like they know the rules were not properly stated.

Of the 3 non sbr members who have chimed in, 2 have agreed with me and 1 has disagreed with me. No matter how you slice it, there is an argument to be made that the wager should be graded as a win, and they now changed the current rules because they acknowledge that "complete phrase" is not what the rules should have stated if they wanted it word for word. But the fact is, that's what it said.

I think me asking for the wager to be graded as no action is a MORE than fair compromise in this case, and I am hoping it is an agreement that can be reached to put the issue behind us. I will be writing in.

[luctens]

Whatever the rights and wrongs of how this bet should be settled, if there is even an argument one way or the other then as this is such a mug market, BetOnline would be best to just pay the bet on the basis of trying to get you to continue betting with them as if you're betting on crap like this on a regular basis, BetOnline have got absolutely nothing to worry about in regards to losing money to you in the long term and their sole aim should be to get you to bet with them for life.

They better settle it quickly though as otherwise another bookmaker may have the pleasure of enjoying some more pearlers on the Clinton speech.

[TheGuesser]

5Dimes had the same Prop. How did they grade it? I side with the book, but I knew these props would cause a problem as soon as I saw them posted. Figured some 5D Tony chats would be entertaining.

[rangerz2478]

5Dimes had the same Prop. How did they grade it? I side with the book, but I knew these props would cause a problem as soon as I saw them posted. Figured some 5D Tony chats would be entertaining.

I could be wrong but I think the wording on 5dimes said EXACT phrase, not complete. So they wouldn't have an issue.

[rangerz2478]

Currently 5dimes actually has "complete" for the Hilary bets. I thought they had "exact" on the Trump ones but someone would have to verify who bets there.

[5918mike]

I think the book was within their right to grade it the way they did.

[dhristov211]

So he says the exact phrase and adds an adjective in between and its one of the saddest angles you've seen posted on here?

Yea, this is right up there with the people take a shot on something random with no knowledge of the actual rules of the sportsbook. There is no case to be made here. Cmon now.

you say 'honey i'm home' or you say 'honey i'm fukking home fuk my life'

different meanings

it's how language work lol