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They charge commission on your winnings i.e. net profit on the market. The base commission is 5% of your winnings , but increased to 7% for most countries. Pinnacle's commission free odds offer more value than an exchange. Exchanges are good but the way commission is deducted after the bet leads people to misinterpret the extent of their value.Originally Posted by Hareeba!
I've been using Betfair for over a decade so don't really need the explanation of how their commission works thanks.
I'm paying around 3%.
You're right SOME people don't know the true worth of pre-commission odds and are fooled into thinking they are getting better odds than they might at a bookmaker.
But I've been talking about ME. I know how to do the maths thanks. And more often than not I can get better net odds at Matchbook or Betfair than I can at Pinnacle.
And I don't have to worry about being limited to one withdrawal per month or any fees.
I can live without Pinnacle.
It's not like Betfair hides the net odds after commission.
They show clearly in your market whatif calc
Since a few years you can also open a Pinnacle account through a brokerage service. Book to broker transfers are always free for players, no fee or rollover of any kind required.
Probably the biggest difference with pinnacle verse matchbook/bet fair is liquidity on certain sports
I'm sure you get more down at pinnacle on various sports
Possibly true depending on when you are looking to bet but frankly I've not found it an issue as I'm not a massive bettor and I expect most forum members would find plenty adequate volume for US sports at Matchbook.
Matchbook volume definitely has increased through the last couple of years
Betfair definately more known for a horse, tennis, soccer volume
Betfair withdraws from another country..Good bye Switzerland!
Probably, UK will be the only "Betfair-Available" country in future..
Matchbook liquidity is getting better each day. Many times, I can get a much better price then Pinnacle despite stupid comission system. Why you charge people even they lose? It's really weird. %1 Comission is very good but I hope they change this comission structure.
Betdaq is the most stupid firm in universe. They can't take advantage of Betfair's downfalls and mistakes.
Yes, Matchbook is excellent for US sports and soccer and a bit of tennis where more often than not you can get better odds than at Pinnacle.
But just can't match the others for sheer number of markets. And of course they don't offer racing.
Betfair is still my most valuable agency.
Is betfair losing countries because of some sort of fee they impose???
Betfair, matchbook, SBO are nothing special for American sports.
Look at SBO's options for nhl and nfl....blah..
Pinnacle 5x is stupid and way too much..should be 1x
They have been increasing their commission charges for a range of countries.
Fortunately the standard commission rate for Australia is still 5% before your loyalty based discount which can reduce it to as low as 2%.
For most players there are no other fees. No withdrawal fees.
I suspect it might be the other way around. Countries losing Betfair due to the tax/regulations they impose.
No withdrawal fees enough said
Just saw this thread and had to read, it was as great as I thought...their BS practices also include taking the sharpest action in the world with the highest limits in addition to requiring a fee to instantly withdraw a deposit that if not wired wouldn't even have cleared in that timeframe using their other deposit methods.
This is literally the only rule you see when you go to deposit/withdraw and it's clear as day. If you bet, win or lose they're you're out on most markets. Pinny is always fair, especially with long standing accounts and consistently processes withdrawal in the 5 figures within an hour. Fair is also you paying a fee to instantly have money sent back you sent them a day earlier, maybe you've experienced such fees in a thing called a bank previously. I feel like something is blatantly omitted here, otherwise you're mad about playing at the best sportsbook in business which applies their own rules so you're going to go play at one a notch below. I don't see winning a couple $50 bets as motivation to quit gambling and Pinny isn't sweating the loss since I'm pretty sure they value high volume sharp accounts far more with their business model.
Sorry for the sarcasm but your post was ridiculous, not the 5x rollover which was implemented for a reason. You have no beef and the $120 fee isnt life ending if you're in a jam and need the money back for an emergency....if you're really a long standing account with them they're reasonable and don't care whether you're a winner or loser they treat both the same. This thread screams b.s.
Yes, they are good. Yes, they are generally fair. Yes, they pay very promptly.
BUT nothing justifies a 5x turnover requirement unless they provide a deposit bonus - which they don't.
It's not really a 5x rollover as they don't keep your money hostage. You've seen some of the posts from people who want to deposit 10k, bet 2k of it, then withdraw the lot next day. I guess the 5x does feel highish compared to how it was, but doing something about the profit leak from free money transfers was justifiable. We were subsidizing these type of players before.
You still use them don't you?
It is a 5x rollover requirement with a penalty for not complying with it.
And as indicated in other thread(s) the method of its application can be grossly unfair.
If there were players abusing free money transfers they are the ones who should be hit with a fee. Not everyone!
No other book I know has more than a 1x turnover requirement.
Yes I still do play there but I've vowed never to make another deposit whilst this abhorrent rule remains.
What that rule is also doing now is discouraging me from withdrawing some of what seems to be an excessive balance for me because I fear that if I do need to put some back the 5x rule will be applied to the new deposit. There's no credit for past turnover.
Last edited by Hareeba!; 10-05-14 at 03:27 PM.
You guys can't be serious! In this day and age a guy deposits $4,000 and makes a few $50 bets and the expectation is he should be able to cash out, really!! It's textbook money laundering in the purest sense! I'm glad pinny has a 5X policy, more books should have it. For instance, if this guy deposited $500, would it really be that unreasonable to expect 50 bets before he withdrawals? These kind of rules protect the industry. The government tells you the pinnys of the world support terrorism through money laundering (even though there are obvious ways to launder money through B&Ms that don't exist online). The 5X rule stops that argument in it's tracks. This guy is either insincere, ignorant, reckless or a combination thereof.
Last edited by harvesters; 10-06-14 at 10:22 AM.
Money laundering!!! What a load of crap!
I have no problem with 1x turnover. So yes if making $50 bets then 80 if you deposit $4,000, not 400!
Which "guy"?
I resent being labelled "insincere, ignorant, reckless"
Lol I don't believe money laundering was their primary motivation for implementing this.
Is what it is, no point complaining about it you take the good with the bad. It's generally not a problem for the clients they have.
Simply accepting something which is clearly wrong without complaining will only encourage others to follow their lead.
I've made it very clear to Pinnacle that I won't accept this charge and will not be making any fresh deposits whilst it remains in force. Of course a lone protest from a small player like me isn't going to have any real effect on them at all. Unfortunately, one thing I've learned about punters over the years is what an utterly apathetic lot they are when it comes to standing up for their interests.
You're insecure if anything happened EXCEPT a change of heart after you deposited the money, I think many people have documented how dumb it is to deposit $4k if you're only planning to do a few $50 bets.
You're ignorant if you think in this day and age it would be acceptable to do 80 $50 bets then cash out on a $4000 deposit. G-20 governments around the world would all describe this as being a haven for money launderers - which is inherently bad for the industry.
You're reckless if you deposit $4k to make a few $50 bets.
Period.
Deal.
You accuse me of ignorance yet carry on with all this utter crap about this being an example of money laundering!!
Astonishing that some people actually believe that receiving a payout from a bookmaker automatically cleanses dodgy money!
It does.
Q: What was the source of this deposit?
A: I won that money gambling online and deposited it into my bank account.
Done.
As I suggested - sheer ignorance / naivety!
Do you really think any law enforcement agency would simply accept that without requiring detailed account transactions to establish how much of a withdrawal was winnings and asking for the source of any deposits to the the account?
Done indeed!
LOL - OK you got me there genius. You clearly understand the nuances of money laundering and what law enforcement needs to do to prove a case. WOW, just WOW!
Hareeba do you also go by the name GUV by chance?
it's his money, he should be able to withdral it when ever. that's why americans liked pinnicle so much in the day because of there easey cash out.
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pinnacle has gone down hill this year as the cs and tech have fallen behind others. i had 300+ in my account, they asked me to change my password, then locked me out. Maybe it was the thousands I have withdrawn, or the password, but they haven't returned 10 emails, and i filed a few complaints, but don't expect much as pinnacle sponsors sites like these that take complaints. Oh ya, tried to change password, they sent me temporary which did not work. stay away from pinnicle, bet365 and 5Dimes , sportsinteraction are so much better.
"We are currently experiencing delays in our usual email response time. Thank you for your patience in this matter."
Calm down Canada, the waiting is frustrating but if you have done nothing wrong I am confident you'll get your money.
I'm starting to doubt everything you say Canada.
When did you submit these complaints that SBR has ignored?
And you can keep your ranting to the one thread you started about your problem from here on in please.
are you kidding? you don't know what you're talking about. pinnacle is the fastest paying book in the world, especially with e-wallets.
pinnacle pay me in 3 hours with skrill, and once only take 1h25 for 1300,00.
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