1. #1
    irish1
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    Build a new Hall Of Fame.

    Build a new HOF building and make 10 times the size it is now. That way you can stop this bullshittt first and second and third ballot garbage. After 5 years retired you get a vote, either you're in or you're out. Do it that way and this vote becomes easy. Guerrrero, Bagwell, Ivan Rodriguez and Martinez you're in. Whenever Mike Mussina comes up, you're in. Now do it that way, if the numbers say you're in then so be it. It's a crime that some people aren't in the hall, like Gil Hodges, Fred McGriff and even Joe Carter. That is just a few examples. In case anyone is interested Hodges had more HR's and More RBI's than Edgar Martinez in less at bats. Not putting the Crime Dog in first time around is a joke! Joe Carter drove in 100 or more runs 10 times or more. So, you see the system used now is pathetic. Make it bigger and one vote. Raines, sorry but you just don't belong in the hall of fame with the greats. With the new system vote no on Raines and he is done. Move on.

  2. #2
    irish1
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    People that should be in are not and it is because of the current system. Lets go back, Gil Hodges played for the great Dodger teams. Look at his numbers 370 HR's and drove in over 100 for seven straight seasons. Ted Simmons of the Cardinals and few other teams but I remember him mostly with the Redbirds. Look at the number of catchers in the hall of fame. It's a tough position and not many are great hitters as witnessed by today's catchers. Anyway, he had a .285 career average, over 1300 RBI's, 250HR and over 2400 hits. He also drove in 90-100 runs eight times. Dave Parker (the Cobra) This guys numbers are awesome. 339 HR's, 1500 RBI's, over 500 2B's, numerous gold gloves and 1 MVP. His career average was over .290. Carlos Delgado should've have gone in right away. 473 HR's, over 2000 hits, 483 2B's, 9 times over 100 RBI's, 3 times over 90 RBI's, career average .280. Now here is a good stat for his career averaged 99 runs scored per season. Hey he probably will get in but should have gone in already. Maglio Ordonez by the numbers is a hall of famer. .309 batting average, 294 HR's, Drove in 100 plus 7 times, 426 2B's and over 2100 hits. I didn't even scratch the surface of people who got screwed by the current system of 1st, 2nd and 3rd ballot garbage. Either in or out, one vote. Add Fred McGriff and Joe Carter to this group and you got some awesome players left out. There are a ton more. Change this system, 5 year wait and one vote.

  3. #3
    irish1
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    A few more players who are hall of famers, Bobby Bonds scored over 100 runs 5 straight years, did it 6 times and scored 90+ ten times in his career. Stole over 400 bases and hit over 300 HR's and over 1000 RBI's He was a great outfielder on top of everything else winning three golden gloves. Accomplished all that is 14 years. How do you keep this guy out? Hits with power, drives in runs, scores runs, steal bases and had a rocket for an arm. It's criminal for him to not be in.

  4. #4
    irish1
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    Granted this guy was an emotionally disturbed individual but his career in one of the best in baseball history. Albert Belle. Just look at his numbers and they will blow you away. I am no fan of him but how do you leave him out? He was nuts!

  5. #5
    irish1
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    Here is another solid player who should be in the hall of fame. Lance Parrish should definitely be in. Good offensive catchers are always hard to come by. He hit 324 HR's and drove in over 1000 and also smacked over 300 doubles. He was an 8 time all star and a 3 time Gold Glove. All that = HOF. Oh, and thats right, Jorge Posada is also a hall of famer. His numbers for catchers definitely justify it, besides he was a 5 time all star at the hardest position in the game. He blasted 275 and drove in over 1000 with a career .273, also smacked 375 doubles. Not bad for 15 years. Really good hitting catchers only come along once in a while. Their should not be a limit on the number of players that can go in every year. That ballot system has got to go. If the player is worthy then put him in if not it's over one vote. the 5 year waiting period is fine. This system is a joke.

  6. #6
    irish1
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    Al Oliver quietly got overlooked back in the day. It's not just homeruns, it's how complete of a player you were. Tom Seaver once said that Al Oliver was the toughest guy for him to get out. Al Oliver is 57 on the all time hits list (2743), he is 100 on the all time RBI list (1326), was 49th on the all time doubles list (529), was a 7 time all star and had a career average of .303. He also had 2 seasons with 200+ hits and managed to smack 219 homeruns. This guy was a pure all around hitter. This is the kind of player that the Hall of fame should be made of. Oh, and by the the way he was also one of the toughest guys in baseball to strikeout. In 1980 he had over 656 at bats and only struck out 47 times. Nuff said!!!!
    Last edited by irish1; 01-26-17 at 04:57 PM.

  7. #7
    irish1
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    Steve Garvey is another example of why the system is broke and a joke. Just like Al Oliver, he was a pure hitter with one of the best swings in his era. His career was excellent. He was a 10 time all star, 4 consecutive years won the Golden Glove, 82nd on the all time hits list (2599), 109th on the all time RBI list (1308), 440 doubles, 272 homeruns and had a .294 career. Those are all great numbers but still I have some more impressing stats that definitely should have put him in that Hall. Only 16 people in the history of baseball have had 5 or more 200 hit seasons and Steve Garvey is one, he had 6 200+ seasons. Oh, and like Al Oliver, he was one of the toughest to stikeout as well. In 1979 with 697 at bats he struck out only 59 times. Just another pure hitter who hit for average, power, drove in runs and was a great fielder. A complete player who won't be in the HOF. It's criminal!

  8. #8
    irish1
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    Andres Galarraga had a solid career and I think he is worthy of a spot in the HOF. The Numbers on him are impressive, 70th all time on the RBI list (1425), 56 in HR's (399), 142nd in hits (2333), 112th in doubles (444) and a .288 career average. Mix that with a couple of gold gloves and a handful of all star appearances which in my book equals a Hall Of Famer. Not bad for 17 years. The Big Cat should already be in.

  9. #9
    irish1
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    Dwight Evans is another player who got overlooked. He is in the top 100 all time 64th in HR's (385),82nd in RBI's (1384) and 79th in doubles(483). His career average was .272, a 3 time All star and more importantly an 8 time gold glover. You didn't try to stretch a single into a double to often with that guy out there. I think he belongs.

  10. #10
    irish1
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    A few teams have no players in the HOF. The Marlins, Diamondbacks, Rockies, Angels and I believe Tampa bay. However, I look at Garret Anderson's career and he just might be the first Angel who should be. Tori Hunter is not eligible yet but should eventually make it. Anderson was as solid as they come and didn't really get hurt for the most part. Anderson by the numbers, 94th on the all time hits list (2529), 87th all time on the RBI list (1365), 48th on the all time doubles list (522) and carried a .293 batting average. He played all 3 outfield positions, mostly LF and played them all well. When you're in the top 100 in those categories with every player who has ever played, it should mean a lot. I have to give Garret Anderson the NOD and vote yes.

  11. #11
    irish1
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    There are 22 shortstops in the HOF. So, after taking a good look at this guys stats and career, I've come to the conclusion that he is a definite hall of famer. Nomar Garciaparra should have been put in the hall already. Just like catchers, look at the position and look at the shortstops already in. Out of the 22 in the hall, only 2 have a higher career batting average than Nomar. Look at HR's, only 3 (Ernie Banks, Cal Ripken and Robin Yount) have hit more than Nomar. Only 10 out of the 22 have more RBI's than Nomar. Oh and Nomar has a higher slugging percentage than any shortstop in mlb history. Nomar was the 1997 rookie of the year and was a 6 time all star. So he hit more HR's than the likes of Barry Larkin, Ozzie Smith, Louis Aparicio and Pee Wee Reese. He had a higher batting average than Barry Larkin, Ozzie Smith, Pee Wee Reese and Louis Aparicio , just to name a few. How can anyone who is the least bit familiar with baseball tell me that Nomar Garciaparra is not a hall of famer? Too top it all off, Nomar played 5 years less than almost all of those shortstops and still had better offensive numbers. Criminal, I tell ya!

  12. #12
    irish1
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    Correction on Nomar Garciaparra's slugging %. Only Alex Rodriguez had a higher slugging % for a shortstop than Nomar. A-roid was .550 and Nomar was.520. Still Nomar is among the top players all time at SS.

  13. #13
    irish1
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    Here is a player from the past and it's disgraceful that he is not in the Hall Of Fame. Vern Stephens. just look at his numbers and he was a great hitting shortstop.
    Year Age Tm Lg G PA AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI SB CS BB SO BA OBP SLG OPS OPS+ TB GDP HBP SH SF IBB Pos Awards
    1941 20 SLB AL 3 2 2 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 .500 .500 .500 1.000 162 1 0 0 0 /6
    1942 21 SLB AL 145 621 575 84 169 26 6 14 92 1 3 41 53 .294 .341 .433 .774 115 249 15 0 3 *6 MVP-4
    1943 22 SLB AL 137 571 512 75 148 27 3 22 91 3 2 54 73 .289 .357 .482 .839 141 247 11 0 5 *6O/79 AS,MVP-9
    1944 23 SLB AL 145 628 559 91 164 32 1 20 109 2 2 62 54 .293 .365 .462 .826 129 258 3 1 6 *6 AS,MVP-3
    1945 24 SLB AL 149 632 571 90 165 27 3 24 89 2 1 55 70 .289 .352 .473 .825 133 270 11 1 5 *6/5 MVP-6
    1946 25 SLB AL 115 488 450 67 138 19 4 14 64 0 1 35 49 .307 .357 .460 .817 122 207 12 0 3 *6 AS,MVP-19
    1947 26 SLB AL 150 634 562 74 157 18 4 15 83 8 4 70 61 .279 .359 .406 .765 111 228 7 0 2 *6 MVP-31
    1948 27 BOS AL 155 715 635 114 171 25 8 29 137 1 0 77 56 .269 .350 .471 .821 113 299 25 2 2 *6 AS,MVP-4
    1949 28 BOS AL 155 712 610 113 177 31 2 39 159 2 2 101 73 .290 .391 .539 .930 137 329 19 0 0 *6 AS,MVP-7
    1950 29 BOS AL 149 693 628 125 185 34 6 30 144 1 0 65 43 .295 .361 .511 .872 113 321 21 0 0 *6 AS,MVP-24
    1951 30 BOS AL 109 415 377 62 113 21 2 17 78 1 2 38 33 .300 .364 .501 .865 123 189 22 0 0 5/6 AS
    1952 31 BOS AL 92 337 295 35 75 13 2 7 44 2 2 39 31 .254 .343 .383 .726 96 113 8 1 2 65
    1953 32 TOT AL 90 329 294 30 77 14 0 5 31 2 0 31 42 .262 .332 .361 .693 85 106 10 0 4 5/6
    1953 32 CHW AL 44 143 129 14 24 6 0 1 14 2 0 13 18 .186 .261 .256 .516 38 33 3 0 1 5/6
    1953 32 SLB AL 46 186 165 16 53 8 0 4 17 0 0 18 24 .321 .388 .442 .830 122 73 7 0 3 5
    1954 33 BAL AL 101 393 365 31 104 17 1 8 46 0 3 17 36 .285 .311 .403 .714 102 147 4 0 4 7 5
    1955 34 TOT AL 25 71 62 10 15 3 0 3 7 0 0 7 11 .242 .324 .435 .759 103 27 1 1 1 1 0 5
    1955 34 BAL AL 3 7 6 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 .167 .286 .167 .452 29 1 0 1 0 0 0 /5
    1955 34 CHW AL 22 64 56 10 14 3 0 3 7 0 0 7 11 .250 .328 .464 .792 110 26 1 0 1 1 0 5
    15 Yrs 1720 7241 6497 1001 1859 307 42 247 1174 25 22 692 685 .286 .355 .460 .815 119 2991 169 6 37 8 0
    162 Game Avg. 162 682 612 94 175 29 4 23 111 2 2 65 65 .286 .355 .460 .815 119 282 16 1 3

  14. #14
    irish1
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    irish1
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    Just put Lou Whitaker in! He was very good in the field, had over 1000 RBI's, 244 HR's, over 400 doubles and career average of .276. Those stats are not to far off the second basemen that are in there now. Come on, a few gold gloves, some all star trips and ROY. That's good enough for me.

  16. #16
    irish1
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    Harold Baines is a tough one but hey by the numbers the man is a hall of famer. Him and Edgar Martinez should go in as DH's. Baines played more at the DH than he did in the field. He still played over 1000 games in the outfield but much more at the DH. Anyway, Harold was 45th on the all time hits list(2866), 65 on the HR list (384), 32 on the RBI's list (1628) and 72 on the doubles list(488). He also had a career .289 average. He goes in as a DH and the career justifies it. Top 75 in all major offensive catagories.

  17. #17
    unusialsusp5
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    all good players but none of them are hall of fame worthy. low batting averages are keeping most of them out. longevity on some of them. baseball hall of fame special. other sports let just about anyone in with decent stats.

  18. #18
    irish1
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    I don't really agree about the low batting averages keeping any of them out and I'll tell you why. Aparicio (.262), Ozzie Smith (.262) and Pee Wee Reese (.269) all have low batting averages for hall of famers. Nomar Garciaparra has a career average of .313 and he has more HR's than those three. Nomar had over 190 hits 6 times, not one of those shortstops did that and he has the 2nd highest SLG % in history for that position. So, you can't say low averages kept Nomar out. Now catchers is another good example why low averages don't come into play. Gary Carter (.262), Bench (.267) and Roy Campanella(.276) none have super batting averages. So, Ted Simmons had a career batting average of .285, over 2400 hits, over 488 doubles, drove in over 1350 runs and was an 8 time all star. Reggie is Reggie but his average was (.262) Killebrew was a beast but had a (.256) and even the great Brooks Robinson had a(.267). I don't think any of the players I mentioned had averages that low. Except Lance Parrish(.252) but he was a 8 time all star and 3 time golg glove catcher with 324 HR's and over 1000 RBI's. How many catchers in history have over 300 HR's? Hey everyone in the HOF belongs there and I am a huge fan of all those power hitters and pure hitters like Carew, Gynn and George Brett but most if not all the above players belong in the hall of fame. Albert Belle probably had the best hitting career in baseball history and he was a nut job but hey so was Cobb, so put him in. As for longevity, Roy Campanella 10 years, Kirby Puckett 12 years, Ralph Kiner 10 years, Joltin Joe 13 years and Hank Greenberg 13, so I don't hink thats it but hey the great thing about baseball is we can talk and debate players who should be all day. Pitching is next!!!

  19. #19
    irish1
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    Just my opinion but Gil Hodges, Dave Parker, Albert Belle, Ted Simmons, Fred McGriff, Joe Carter, Casrlos Delgado, Magglio Ordonez, Steve Garvey and Vlad Guerrero are hands down no doubt about it hall of Famers. I would like to know how jeff Kent was not put in already? That is a Joke!

  20. #20
    unusialsusp5
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    i see your point somewhat but the voting qualifications are so stringent for a reason. your candidates are just a sliver below the truly elite that they apparently want in the hall. you could argue for rocky colavito and felipe alou to be in but they fell just short in their era. they just didn't want it cluttered like the dogs they have in the nba and nfl hall of fame.

  21. #21
    irish1
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    Here are some of my honorable mention for the Hof and some could be in there.Del Ennis, I forgot about but this guy he should be in the HOF already. .284 career average and knocked in over 100 runs 7 times. Ted Klusewski(good power hitter n hit for average), Ken Boyer( great fielder and hitter), Maury Wills (won an MVP and great base stealer), Norm Cash, Boog Powell, Tony Oliva, Lee May, Dale Murphy, Alan Trammel, Moises Alou , Don Baylor and Moe Vaughn.

  22. #22
    irish1
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    Lets talk pitchers! Sportswriters once again showed their lack of sports knowledge by not inducting Mike Mussina first time around. This guy won 270 and struckout 2800 and 7 gold gloves to go with 16 winning seasons. I'm sorry but anyone who doesn't think this guy is a instant hall of famer is not thinking clearly.

  23. #23
    irish1
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    Two Pitchers from the 1969 Orioles Mike Cuellar and Dave McNally should be in the hall of fame. Both only pitched 13 years. I'll start with Mike Cuellar- He won the CY award in 1969, had 4- 20 win seasons winning 185 games with a 3.14 ERA. Pretty good for 13 years and was on one of the greatest staffs in baseball history. Now, Dave McNally was very similar. Again only 13 years winning 184 games with 4- 20 win seasons with a 3.24 ERA and a .607 winnng %. Not very many pitchers had 4- 20 win seasons in a row like McNally or win 18 or more games 6 straight years like Cuellar. I know alot of people will question these two but I say should've been in.

  24. #24
    unusialsusp5
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    Quote Originally Posted by irish1 View Post
    Two Pitchers from the 1969 Orioles Mike Cuellar and Dave McNally should be in the hall of fame. Both only pitched 13 years. I'll start with Mike Cuellar- He won the CY award in 1969, had 4- 20 win seasons winning 185 games with a 3.14 ERA. Pretty good for 13 years and was on one of the greatest staffs in baseball history. Now, Dave McNally was very similar. Again only 13 years winning 184 games with 4- 20 win seasons with a 3.24 ERA and a .607 winnng %. Not very many pitchers had 4- 20 win seasons in a row like McNally or win 18 or more games 6 straight years like Cuellar. I know alot of people will question these two but I say should've been in.
    you're continuing to come up with players who ended up as better than average but not in the elite class which is what's required to get into the sacred hall.

  25. #25
    irish1
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    Hey unusailsusp5, are there any pitchers right now currently playing who can win 20 or more 4 straight years? The best pitchers currently are Justin Verlander, Max Scherzer, Clayton Kershaw and Felix Hernandez. None of them have won 20 games 4 times in a row and probably never will. They have won 20 but to do it 4 consecutive seasons is quite another thing. Cuellar and McNally pitched in an era with some teriffic players and that feat has them hall of fame worthy to me. Cuellar was 20 three times in a row then 18,18, and another 20 win season. McNally was 4 straight. Would you say they were dominant in their 13 years ? Is the hall of fame about dominance? Were they two of the best pitchers in their time?

  26. #26
    irish1
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    I do have to say that the sportswriters did do a good job as far as the pitchers to go in the HOF. Almost all that should be in are in. There are a whole lot of good pitchers that just were a step below HOF material. Jim Kaat won 283 games but somehow is not HOF material. His win/loss record was just not good enough and even though he pitched 25 years still could not manage 3000 K's. He really only had 3 real good years. Good but not good enough for the HOF. Luis Tiant is an interesting case? He won 20+ 4 times, pitched good in post season, a career 3.30 ERA and innings to hits was excellent. He did win 229! Kevin Brown was good (211-144), not sure if his numbers are good enough? Have to say no. Curt Schilling is a no! After looking at his numbers, he really only had 3 real good years out of 20. In fact he had 9 seasons without a winning record. So, good post season or not he is a no. Does an old timer like Allie Reynolds belong (182-107) ? He was a model of consistency. Short career 12 years but hey averaged 15 wins a year.

  27. #27
    unusialsusp5
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    Quote Originally Posted by irish1 View Post
    Hey unusailsusp5, are there any pitchers right now currently playing who can win 20 or more 4 straight years? The best pitchers currently are Justin Verlander, Max Scherzer, Clayton Kershaw and Felix Hernandez. None of them have won 20 games 4 times in a row and probably never will. They have won 20 but to do it 4 consecutive seasons is quite another thing. Cuellar and McNally pitched in an era with some teriffic players and that feat has them hall of fame worthy to me. Cuellar was 20 three times in a row then 18,18, and another 20 win season. McNally was 4 straight. Would you say they were dominant in their 13 years ? Is the hall of fame about dominance? Were they two of the best pitchers in their time?
    no, and you know the reason. relief pitching and pitch count. bert blyleven belongs also though. you continue to want to put A- and B+ players in. cuellar and mcnally fall into that category. wins are just as much of a trademark of having a good team behind you. not checking but their WHIP's are probably above 1 which would keep them out.

  28. #28
    irish1
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    Quote Originally Posted by unusialsusp5 View Post
    no, and you know the reason. relief pitching and pitch count. bert blyleven belongs also though. you continue to want to put A- and B+ players in. cuellar and mcnally fall into that category. wins are just as much of a trademark of having a good team behind you. not checking but their WHIP's are probably above 1 which would keep them out.
    Bert Blyleven does deserve to be in there with 287 wins and over 3700 K's. He did play for some average teams. You do know that Blyleven is in. However, Cuellar and McNally both had better whip's than Nolan Ryan, Steve Carlton and Whitey Ford. Just for your info out of all the hall of fame pitchers only two had a whip of under 1 and it was two real old timers before you or I were born. Addie Joss and Ed Walsh from the 1800's. Everyone else is over 1.

  29. #29
    irish1
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    There are a couple of very interesting inductees that are questionable. Hal Newhouser comes to mind. He had a few lights out years and I mean a few but the overall record and stats is up in the air. I guess a question to ask is, can you have a dominating 5 year period and get into the HOF while the rest of your career is average at best? It seems that way with Koufax and Newhouser. Think about that? If so, is Ron Guidry, Dwight Gooden, Luis Tiant, Wes Ferrell, Jr Richard and a few others who had that 5 year greatness hall of famers?

  30. #30
    irish1
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    Saves is another thing altogether in the HOF. three things I think should be required to make it into the hall of fame as a saves guy, 1.) 500 saves minium and 2.) 100+ wins and 3.) average 30 saves per year. Do two out of the three and you're in. Otherwise get lost. There has to be some criteria for a saves guy to meet before entering the hall of fame. Anyone with better criteria post it. Averaging 30 saves per season is really not that tough. Maybe just 500 saves or forget it. I don't know.
    Last edited by irish1; 02-10-17 at 09:27 AM.

  31. #31
    irish1
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    For saves guys forget about 100 wins, that ridiculously high. Too many variables, have to look at everything, saves, ERA, now blown saves, wins, losses and saves per year. I would have to say at least 400 saves minimum for consideration.

  32. #32
    irish1
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    John Franco should be in the HOF. He had a 2.89 era, 424 saves and won 90 games. His post season numbers are real good as well. In the post season he pitched 14 innings gave up 3 runs for a 1.88 era with 10 K's. Just put Johnny boy in there!! He is top five all time, so whats the problem? Now Billy Wagner is 6 all time in saves with 422 but this guys post season stats are bad enough to turnoff anyone. He and Lee Smith were horrible in the post season. I'm on the fence with those two? Mariano and Trevor Hoffman should be no brainers. Mariano's 652 saves might not ever get touched and his post season numbers will absolutely blow you away. Hoffman 601 saves, even that might not get matched again and his post season was just decent but hey, this dude is a hall of famer.

  33. #33
    irish1
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    Kenly Jansen and Aroldis chapman are the only ones who have a shot at Mariano's 652 saves. Can they last another 10-15 years without breaking down, and how long will that 100 fastball stay up there? They will undoubtedly be hall of fame closers but the odds are against them catching Mariano's 652. I really don't see 652 being surpassed!

  34. #34
    KeyElement
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    Betpoints: 846

    A few comments
    Dwight Evans - probably the greatest right field arm of all time. It wasn't just second, you never took any extra base versus that laser.
    Lou Whitaker - Trammell-Whitaker was the best double play combo of all time, hands down
    Mike Mussina - being penalized for all those lousy Oriole teams he had to play for. Past his prime with the Yankees

    Closers - Easily the most overrated position in the game. Go in and get three outs when your team has a lead. Isn't every pitcher on your staff supposed to be able to do that? Only 1 in 9 times (mathematically) will you face the oppositions 1, 2, 3 lineup. Starters do that immediately every single game and are expected to see those same guys 3 times per start. It will be interesting to see if voters delay or back off of Hoffman and then rush Rivera in on the first ballot.

    Since 88.9% of the time a closer will NOT face the opponents preferred batting order, I think they should have a minimum of 300 saves with an 88.8% or better conversion rate to even be considered. JMHO

    A final thought for closer lovers. Is Rivera a shoo-in? Yeah, probably, but did you ever hear of a one pitch starter having success? FFT.

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